Oh yeah I know and it wasn't directed at you, if that wasn't clear. But more to the point of, we use all that material and waste so much to get a flush/glass surface.
Sent from my 2201117SG using Tapatalk
Oh yeah I know and it wasn't directed at you, if that wasn't clear. But more to the point of, we use all that material and waste so much to get a flush/glass surface.
Sent from my 2201117SG using Tapatalk
Yeah sorry, didn't think you were having a go. Just meant to reiterate the sanding part.Originally Posted by RocknRolf
And, yes, I wouldn't be surprised if more poly ended up in the rag each time than what goes on the timber!
I know we try and balance a thick enough coat to protect the timber and a thin enough one that it's not "too thick", but literally paper-thin is thin!
IMO, the whole "thin finish is better" debate is just more internet BS when it comes to electric solid body guitars.
Acoustics and maybe semi-acoustics, yeah, but that's a whole other kettle of fish...
Making the world a better place; one guitar at a time...
I just use Cabots water base poly. Its not a wipe on but you can spray it on as well as use a brush but I found it was easier to use a wipe on approach as I dont get any runs and its easier to control the amount you apply to the surface. Plus if you need to thin it or clean up you just use tap water which is much cheaper than using some form of turps/metho. Trust me it took quite awhile to perfect my technique to get to the place where I am now but it was well worth it.
The main reason I use a water base was due to the lack of smell and how fast it dries compared to oil base. When it is a little bit too cold to use oil base I can apply it on in my house and let it dry in my spare room and there is no complaints about smell from the missus, unlike when I used oil based poly. I have sprayed in the past but you have to have a reasonable clean area with no wind but when you wipe on I can do that anywhere.
I have used Tru-oil on 2 guitars, one I sanded back and put on poly and the other I sanded with a Scotchbrite as I wanted a satin finish as I found when it was gloss my hand would not slide once I got some sweat on my hand. I had experience using Tru-oil on my gun stocks and on my stocks I only ever used 2 coats and always sanded to a satin/matt finish as I didn't want anything that reflects the sun. On my guitar I only used 3 coats as that was enough but again I made sure when I applied enough per coat and I achieved a gloss finish normally within 2 coats, sometimes with only a single coat but I needed enough to flatten and polish hence I used 2 good coats and then followed that by a thin flat coat. Plus poly is easier to obtain and cheaper and doesn't go off and is another reason why I use poly. I have used oil based poly in the past but was restricted to where I was allowed to hang it to dry.
Builds :
# 1 - Non PBG ES-335
# 2 - Non PBG Tele Thin line
# 3 - Non PBG LP
# 4 - Non PBG SG
# 5 - RC-1
# 6 - TL-1
# 7 - ST-1 Custom
# 8 - SGB-30 + Non PBG SG
# 9 - Custom JRM-1DC 12 String
#10 - Custom ST-1 with P90's
#11 - Custom TL-1 with 27" Bari Neck
#12 - Custom JZ-6 Jazzmaster
#13 - AG-1 Factory Second
#14 - Custom JZ-6 Bass vi
#15 - EX-1R Factory Second
#16 - AGM-1
#17 - EXA-7
So how many coats of poly are too many? I wood burned/painted/clear coated a 20$ ukelele kit to practice and test my products, put on 8 coats of wipe-on, water based polyurethane, wetsanded- and accidentally relic-ed it! I had to touch up and apply a couple more coats of poly. With this telecaster, I'm aiming for between 25-30 coats of wipe on, water based poly before I wet sand. But is there a point where there's too many? When it gets cloudy?
This is the thing I am worst at, but I gather that it depends quite a bit on the product you are using and how it's applied. You may want to say exactly the product you are using, so that anyone who has used it can chime in. There are a lot of differences even between polys
I use a water based poly from General Finishes called "High Performance." You can apply it with a synthetic bristle brush, a foam brush, an applicator pad or a roller. I use a 2" Wooster sash brush or a 2" foam brush, and usually both. The mfg recommends no more than 3 coats. I use 6-10. I find that both bristle and foam brushes leave brushstrokes, and for me 3 coats risks sanding through. With 6 or more I can usually sand out streaks and other imperfections to get the finish pretty flat. There are at least two downsides with this finish. It takes a good 3-4 weeks to cure. It also takes a lot of careful sanding to get it flat. On the upside it has very little odor and very low VOCs. Also water based polys have the lowest propensity to yellow.
I think you can get quicker curing times and flatter finishes with solvent/oil based polys, but others here have more experience with these than I do.
I am using minwax water-based wipe-on polyurethane in clear gloss. At 9 coats, it's pretty shiny, and remarkably flat. That's why I stopped here with the ukelele - it seems done. But when I wet-sanded it, I sanded through in places, even though I felt like I was barely touching the surface. That's why I was figuring on double the coats of the ukelele. But I don't know what the signs are that you're done, since I obviously stopped too early the first time. The ukelele polished very nicely, but it's a 20$ kit going to a 6 yr old, not quite the same as guitar that's hopefully going to be used and treasured for years. I really want the finish to hold up.
FWIW: I have not used a wipe-on water-based poly, and I'm not a fan of wet sanding! I'm also not great at finishes!
For Tru-oil I would typically aim for 2/3 brushed on (thick) coats, then 20+ wiped-on coats. I generally lightly (denib) sand (with 600 or 1200 g) along the way, being very carefully around edges. And gently sand to smooth surface every 5 (or so) coats with increasing grits from 600 to 2000g.
I'm not sure about too many coats, or if it goes cloudy! If it starts going cloudy the wet sand should bring it back a bit.
PitBull Builds: FVB-4, LP-1SS, FBM-1, AG-2, TB-4, SSCM-1, TLA-1,TL-1TB, STA-1HT, DSCM-1 Truckster, ST-1, STA-1, MBM-1, MBM custom, GHR-1 (Resonator), FH-5V (Acoustic).
Scratch Builds: Pine Explorer, Axe Bass, Mr Scary, Scratchy Tele's.
The little voices in my head keep telling me "build more guitars"
Oh yes, thanks, TD, forgot about scuff sanding between coats. I use a 3m maroon sanding pad between coats to ligthly scuff sand. I typically don't scuff sand between the first two or three coats over artwork or decals.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote