Greg's First Build - LP-1MQ #151

[wazkelly]

Hi Simon & Greg, Color Tone is water based and therefore not compatible with turps or any other oil based spirits.

Some of my experimentation did involve blending things in with Tru Oil which I think does have mineral turps as one of its properties but the water based stuff just ended up as tiny little droplets suspended in the TO and therefore did not work.

[GregLane]

Simon I am planning to use metho because of the veneer issue. That's AUS for metholated spirits, alcohol in the US. I don't know what the UK calls it. Aussies are accused of drinking it.

[wazkelly]

Bushman's Vodka & Orange haha!

[Simon Barden]

Ha!. Meths or Methylated Spirits here.

I assumed it was the StewMac ColorTone (I've got some 'Colour Tone' stain from a UK supplier but that is certainly water-based). It's just that I'm sure I saw a StewMac video where they said to dissolve some in acetone for some spot-repair jobs, but maybe I misunderstood and they were referring to some raw powder stain or their liquid pigment for lacquer.

P.S. the UK suppler doesn't seem to be calling it 'colour tone' any more.

[wazkelly]

Hmmm, Stewmac site tends to suggest the stuff can be diluted with either water or alcohol therefore it could be worth experimenting with a drop or two in a small amount of TO to see how that turns out. If that works it would be the way to go to prevent any further dramas with the veneer top.

http://www.stewmac.com/How-To/Online...tructions.html

The stuff I got was already overly diluted down with water by a local distributor/supplier who was going out of business and therefore no recourse.

[Simon Barden]

The UK luthier supply sites seem to be growing in scope by the day. There now seem to be a number based around Manchester supplying nitro cans and now (nitro for spray-guns) that I presume all have the same basic local supplier. But they are also adding acrylics, stains and basic dye powders. They are now also offering some wax and oil finishes (though not a very wide range as yet). I'd like to try a non-spray finish as it's a lot easier to do indoors. But after buying a lot of compressors, spray guns and ancillary tools in a short space of time, I need to let my finances recover first before starting another guitar.

[GregLane]

I came across a reference on the web last night that Transtint in the UK is ColorTone in the US. The bottles look the same and both can be mixed with metho (I prefer bundy).

Was I like your idea of the stained Tru-Oil. It would reduce the risk of veneer bubbling that's for sure. I have sent a question to StewMac.

My only concerns would be that I would not get the chance to try and pop the grain with the wipe on/off method and second I feel the working time would be reduced significantly. I could add some turps to thin it a bit though.

[wazkelly]

Have never thinned down Tru Oil as it already seems thin enough. Do you have any of the US supplied Color Tone? If so, put a couple of drops in with a few drops of Tru Oil, give it a really good shake and see how well it blends. My theory is that the full strength stuff should mix in with TO as it can be thinned down with Metho.

Here is a testimonial from the Stewmac site where the customer mixed it in with Nitro
http://www.stewmac.com/Materials_and...id_Stains.html

Right-straight-up Blue Super Axe By Irish from Virginia Beach, VA
(Customer's Reviews) Tuesday, September 06, 2016
After a lengthy Super Axe build using all NOS vintage Gretsch parts, we were in a quandary over what color to lacquer...(?) After a couple of drops of Color Tone straight blue into the stringed instrument nitro-lacquer, it took abt 2 seconds to decide. We are VERY happy with the results! Definitely recommended!

That makes me think full strength is compatible with blending in Tru Oil and should also to give a 'toffee apple' look if that is what you are after.

To get the popping effect find the shade you want and put down a diluted one that is a bit lighter as subsequent ones will make the first one come out darker.

As always, best to test these ideas out on scrap timber before committing to your build project.

[GregLane]

I thought Nitro (nitrocellulose ??) was an entirely different product to an oil based like Tru-Oil which is different again from Estapol type (polyester). I saw an article today about what all the types were and what went with what but didn't have the patience to go through it.
I will report what StewMac replies. If they do.

[Simon Barden]

It is all very different stuff. What we are trying to find out through your experimenting is what other substances the concentrated ColorTone stain is capable of dissolving in. Once it's mixed with water we know it's no good trying to mix it with with any oil based materials, but we're thinking that the full-strength ColorTone might very well mix with Tru-Oil, so it's worth trying it out in a small quantity to see if it does mix in evenly (and so is very usable), or whether it separates out (when it's throw it away time).