Andy40's TLA-1R Build

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Ok I blame this one on Wokks suggesting that I should have more than one build on at once. Combine that with an abuse of my birthday falling 2 days after Christmas and viola! new kit!

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I can safely say that my plans are not yet complete. Not because I am a man of mystery like zeromick....(my photography skillz are no where near as good), I just haven't decided on a finish yet.

I have decided on the following:-
1. It's a right handed kit because i am right handed (check);
2. It's an ash kit because I just had to do one soo badly (check);
3. Black pick guard and chrome hardware (check);
4. DB's signature bone nut (checkaroo)
5. It has a rosewood fretboard because I'm not a massive fan of maple (check);
6. It has Grover mini-locking rotomatics because that deal is....... a w e s o m e (check);
7. It has Tonerider hot classics......just because (double check).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Andy40

Ok I blame this one on Wokks suggesting that I should have more than one build on at once.

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If Wokks was within 40,000 kilometres then we the jury find him guilty as charged and sentence him to another 25 life sentences in the naughty wharehouse - someone has to serve the beer.....

nice build Andy ash tele with some fruity upgrades. what are the stain plans ?
25 years life sentence is bit harsh Gavmiester, but I enjoy being the NW barman !

I am quite partial of the rosewood tele with a satin finish, however I am not a fan of the weight of the rosewood. I think the ash with a stain will bridge that gap nicely.

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Very nice! Love that brown Tele. You've got a great look to aim for there. will be keeping an eye on your thread!

cheers,
Gav.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gavin1393

If Wokks was within 40,000 kilometres then we the jury find him guilty as charged and sentence him to another 25 life sentences in the naughty wharehouse - someone has to serve the beer.....

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If you really wanted to punish Wokka you would sending to the "dry" room in the naughty warehouse ;)

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Originally Posted by Fretworn

If you really wanted to punish Wokka you would sending to the "dry" room in the naughty warehouse ;)

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nah Fretty that's a silly idea bro ! The only dry area is the broom cupboard under the stairs with Pest !
Plus you need someone with experience and beer knowledge running the NW bar !

Nice looking Tele kit / upgrades Andy and a nice body grain. Like your plans - I knocked up a partscaster recently using a brown scheme (FW Japan Black based and satin poly finish)

http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...?t=4437&page=2

Yummy

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Mock build complete!

I am quite amazed with the Grovers, literally just slipped the string through and gave it a few winds and it holds in tune. Unbelievable. I was only going to put in the 1st and 6th strings to check the scale length etc. even played a few tunes :rolleyes:

This was the easiest mock build I have had to date. Mainly because all of the holes were pre-drilled and everything lined up perfectly. Pity though as I'll be changing a few things so some of the holes will need to be filled and others drilled.

the measurements are the same as Bungees - 316mm nut to middle of the 12th. 330mm from centre of 12th to the saddles. However, I'm not worried as I'll need to change the bridge position as I'll be installing an ashtray bridge and string through, most likely Wilkinson compensated.

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Some wonderful grain in that body Andy! Great stuff.

cheers,
Gav.

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Originally Posted by gavinturner

Some wonderful grain in that body Andy! Great stuff.

cheers,
Gav.

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Thanks Gav, yeah i'm pretty stoked

OK, bought a drill guide for about $30 on Ebay. Its ok I suppose for the $30, the reach of the arm is not long enough to drill the string through unless I pivot the base around and clamp it on the the body. Which is fine but I'm still going through beta testing on a thick scrap bit of wood.

Attachment 8142

My current plan is to attach the Wilkinson bridge, align the top E hole, punch it, clamp the press (when aligned), test then drill. repeat the same process for the bottom e hole, then for each string through.

Like I said thats the rough plan for my scrap bit of wood, I guess if I come up with any difficulties it will show up. If anyone has a better suggestion/tactic, please let me know.

I have also measured the scale length with the Wilkinson bridge on the body, squared it, and marked. Similar to Bungee, I have had to replace the adjustment screws that came with the Wilkinson with the PBG ones to get a bit more length.

I plugged the previous PBG bridge holes with Oak doweling and have sanded flat. (the smallest dowling I could get I think was 4mm and I still had to sand it a bit to get it to fit in the holes. I now have oodles of the Oak doweling so if you live in Brissy and you need some, just let me know.

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Anyhoo, I have a decision to make.

Where I have positioned the Wilkinson bridge (in the photo) is best for intonation of the guitar (ie a few mm play for intonation using the PBG adjustment screws).

However, it leaves the oak plugs well in view.

Alternatively, I could position the Wilkinson bridge so I just covers the holes, just like Bungee did http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...?t=4675&page=5

I am not sure if I need to though because I intend to stain the guitar a rosewood colour which may cover up the visibility of the plugs?

Any tips would be appreciated.

Hey Andy, in my experience no matter what colour the stain, the plugs will be highly visible. The plugs are all end grain and they soak up the dye really well. Might be worth pushing the bridge back but there doesn't look like there's much play left in the adjustment screws..

cheers,
Gav.

Thanks Gav, thats good advice. you're right there is not much left in the adjustment screws and I cant get longer screws as they are already too close to the pickup for my liking anyway. I would actually much prefer not to use the PBG screws given how close they are but that would require a big shift in bridge position.

I've ordered a custom colour from DB, rosewood (or as close as possible). I was going to drill and position everything while I was waiting for the "mad scientist" to work his magic, after what you said Gav, I am thinking maybe I should wait, stain it and see how visible the plugs are at that time. If they are visible, I drop the bridge back, if they aren't I'll just remeasure and position the bridge.

G'day Andy,

I used a Wilkinson bridge on this one and the screw holes were within a gnats nasty of the holes for the original bridge, are you absolutely sure you have yours in the correct spot

( disclaimer - this was not a PBG kit but probably came out of different door of the same factory )

@ Dave, Woah what a great tele! is that veneer on the headstock or stain (I cant tell from the photo). I was thinking of putting a veneer on mine but wasn't sure how it would come up with a natural colour maple neck. I think it looks awesome! You don't happen to have a build diary on that one?

I'm pretty sure on the measurements. I've also seen this issue on others' build diaries with the PBG kit. But double checking never hurt anyone.

Wokks mentioned once that even the PBG stock brigde (which is not string through and also longer) should be moved about 5 mm toward the neck to get it within range of good intonation and scale length.

For future reference, the original bridge setup, string holes are set similar to the American standard telecaster i.e forward of the mounting bolts, the latter also only having 3 anchor points not 4, this is the replacement bridge i use on the American standard Tele. it lined up perfect with the string holes and outer mount holes, you just need to drill 2 inner ones. The kit has 4 mounting holes it just may line up perfect.


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Another part of the equation is the bridge pup rout, as it looks like you'll have to modify it a fair bit to fit the pup if you use the forward bridge position. And once you do that they'll be no going back, literally.

As Gav said, the end grain of plugs is pretty tough to hide. I'd recommend putting a few plugs into some scrap wood, something close'ish to body's wood colour, and testing the effect of the DT colour on the plugs vs surrounding wood before making a decision. It may be that embedding a bit of coloured Timbermate (coloured with DT stain, or actual rosewood dust) into the end grain of the plugs could help them to blend/match. Experiment before committing to irreversible changes to the body.

Edit: Also, with that type of 'drill press' frame the tensioning bolts tend to strip and slip, so beware. There can also be a fair amount of play and wander with the drill tip once you start drilling. Practice first on thick scrap wood, as accurate string-through holes are not easy. One thing that can sometimes work if you have an overhanging bench is to clamp the press to the overhang and have the workpiece/body on another bench under it, so you're not restricted by the press' throat depth. You would need a long drill bit and may even need to reverse the press by removing and inverting the press' handle/body on the shaft/pillar so the base is at the top of the shaft. If you can wrangle it into a useable position it could overcome some of its limitations. Another alternative is to mark the string through holes onto the body and then sit the press on the body but drill down through the hole in the centre of the press' base. Hard to do, but may be more stable.

@ Tony, I did look at the joe barden bridge but opted for the cheaper wilkinson. However, the Barden would have been way cooler, I did not realise that the string though holes were forward from the bridge mounts.

@ Wierdy, I think I will do that stain/timbermate test you suggest. I've got come uncoloured timbermate ready for the job. Regarding the drill guide, I hear ya, there is a bit of play there I will check that when doing the test run on scrap. The drill guide was just a cheap solution to me having to "freestyle". I did not think of the overhanging bench/ 2 bench idea. Thats a great idea and may be preferable to clamping the drill guide to the body. Thanks heaps.

Andy after you put the plugs in, then repositioned the bridge mounts, one of these Bardens may have been a drop in, then the plugs would be hidden, but i wouldnt know 100% unless i got to measure one up.

I have 2 coming form the U.S.A for 2 standard series teles i am doing for a bloke, i will have to get some measurements.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Andy40

@ Dave, Woah what a great tele! is that veneer on the headstock or stain (I cant tell from the photo). I was thinking of putting a veneer on mine but wasn't sure how it would come up with a natural colour maple neck. I think it looks awesome! You don't happen to have a build diary on that one?

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G'day Andy,

It's an ash body with maple neck, the headstock is just a lot of coats of the same FW Mahogany stain as the body, it's rather nice to play but is quite heavy ( when the boss goes to the weekender next weekend I'll stick all my guitars on the scales and report back )

I have a bit of a description in the non PB guitars forum but no diary because it's a foreigner, Wilkinson compensated bridge and 1970s Schaller humbuckers ( not tapped ) with the standard controls & tuners.

I really should take the pots up to 500k one day

Quote:

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Originally Posted by WeirdBits

Edit: Also, with that type of 'drill press' frame the tensioning bolts tend to strip and slip, so beware. There can also be a fair amount of play and wander with the drill tip once you start drilling. Practice first on thick scrap wood, as accurate string-through holes are not easy. One thing that can sometimes work if you have an overhanging bench is to clamp the press to the overhang and have the workpiece/body on another bench under it, so you're not restricted by the press' throat depth. You would need a long drill bit and may even need to reverse the press by removing and inverting the press' handle/body on the shaft/pillar so the base is at the top of the shaft. If you can wrangle it into a useable position it could overcome some of its limitations. Another alternative is to mark the string through holes onto the body and then sit the press on the body but drill down through the hole in the centre of the press' base. Hard to do, but may be more stable.

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I've got one of those "drill press" frames as well. I always pre-drill the hole manually to about a mm so I can be sure the holes are in the right place.

OK I remeasured.

The distance from the front of the nut to the middle of the 12th fret is 313mm, thereby a scale length of 626mm.

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The above photo shows that with the Wilkinson bridge covering the plugged holes, the end of the PBG adjustment screws do not make it to the scale length of 626mm.

The below photo shows that if I move the Wilkinson bridge forward so that the end of the PBG adjustment screws are roughly in line with the scale length of 626mm, the plugged holes are quite visible. It would also require a small amount of routing.

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Andy 626mm equates to 24.6457" round up to 24.65"

A Les Paul is 629mm or 24.75"

A Telecaster is 648mm or 25.5"

dont know if this helps you any

Thanks Tony,

As it is preferable to sit the Wilkinson bridge back far enough to cover the plug holes, I guess my question is, the saddles being all the way forward sit at about 629mm - 630mm which is about 3 - 4 mm longer than the distance from the middle of the 12th fret to the nut, am I going to have problems with intonation? I will only be able to lengthen the strings during intonation at that measurement.

Are you going to be able to bring the saddles in about 18mm .70 of an" so they measure at 648mm or 25.5" , mine on a squier affinity i did a bridge mod on, sit fully extended, as long as they intonate when you finger the 12th fret your in business, i have 1" of play between my saddles extended and the back of the bridge so you should do it easy if i am understanding what we are talking about haha

Bubba mod is replacing the old saddles with new brass saddles on the affinity tele

Out with the old
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In with the new
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Done
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Hi Andy, the low E string should be ok about 629/630mm from nut. The high E will have to be about 626-628mm.
Worse comes to worse you should be able to get longer saddle adjusting screws.
Place the bridge as close to the nut as possible to give you the best chance of getting good intonation

Update

MOP Inlays fitted and ready for sanding :o

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I saved the Eye of Sauron for the 15th fret

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I followed Brendans sticky, which was brilliant, however, here's a few things I learnt.

1. In my brilliant foresight, I ordered one inlay more than I needed "just in case". High five past Andy.

2. Brendan recommends drilling the middle of the plastic inlay with a 2-3mm drill bit then gently prying the plastic dot out. My inlays were absolutley caked in with glue, so it didn't matter how gentle I was I ended uplifting a small bit of the rosewood. grrrrr. for the rest I switched to drilling the middle of the plastic dot with the 2-3mm drill bit then gently on backward rotation, then upping the size of the drill bit (on backward rotation) until the plastic dot was gone - that only left the glue. I then used a dremel with the engraving bit (as brendan suggests) to rout out the glue and prep the hole for the MOP inlay.

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3. Dont, do not, never, push the MOP inlay into the hole to check your routing. It will N E V E R come out on its own, and all attempts to get it out only push it deeper. In the end, I had to drill it out, which did not bother me much because I had another one :cool:- hence the brilliant foresight I spoke of earlier.

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good job Andy, the MOP inlays look great. Always order spares ! If you drilled out a bit of rosewood best thing to do is mix glue and some sawdust to build up the level. With practice you will get the depths as close as possible, so the inlay is just a little proud to minimise the sanding.
The job is 100 times easier if it's a scratch neck and the frets aren't installed or if it's a fretless neck !

Andy, when you are measuring your scale length are you measuring from the fretboard side face of the nut to the peak (crown) of the fret wire of the 12th fret? That is, measuring down the centre of the neck to the middle of the actual fret wire?

Just want to be certain that your values are correct before you commit to your bridge placement.

Hey Weirdy,

Yes, yes and no. I measured from the fretboard side of the nut, yes. I measured the centreline down the neck, yes but I measured to the dead centre of the 12th fret (not the crown). I think I followed Gavs instructions on neck positioning for that (also backed up by Stewmac). I think there's a dichotomy of thought there, some people measure to the dead centre of the 12th fret and some measure to the middle of the actual fret wire of the 12th.

Which is right?

Should I have measured to the middle of the actual fret wire? If so that would allow a longer length the the saddles, which would be great.

Hey Andy, you should be measuring to the centre of the 12th fret wire, not the dot marker.
Typically nut to 12th fret on an F type (scale 25.5") should be 323/324mm

Yep, nut to crown/peak/middle of fret wire of 12th fret, like this:

https://www.fretlord.com/v/vspfiles/...emeasuring.jpg

As above, you measure to the center of the fret wire, not the marker, then to the center of your saddles.

YUSS! (air fist pump)

Well that is good news. 323mm from nut face to middle of the 12th fret wire. If I double that measurement to get the scale length, that gives me sufficient room to position the bridge with saddle play for intonation. I don't think I'll need to rout or anything!

Thanks guys for clearing that up.

Hey Andy, generally the low E string saddle will end up being about 326-329mm from 12th fret and high E will be around 323-325mm so as long as your saddles will meet those measurements you should be cooking with gas

You win some, you lose some...Scrap wood string through fail

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The inaccuracy stems from having to clamp the drill guide to the wood drill one hole, then unclamp, re-clamp drill the next...each time reclamping alters the tilt of the base plate which i did not measure with a spirit level each time. The scrap wood is also smaller than the body would be so it will be less stable than actually clamping to the body. nevertheless test 2 will follow sometime this week.

Mount the bridge to the scrap Andy, and it will stay in place, if thats what i am thinking is going on?