EX-5 Build Diary - My First Build Bridge Pilot Hole Question

Hello Everybody!

My EX-5 bass kit has been sitting unbuilt in its box for a year and a half! I didn’t want to start on it until I could see the project through. Now, I’m ready!

I’m going to sand and seal the body and neck today and let it dry all week.

I also need to plan for the bridge mounting with a test fit. Here’s the 1st question:

Do I NEED a drill press to drill pilot holes, or can I get away with using a hand drill?

I was going to buy a dremel drill press but I don’t think it’ll reach and doesn’t look like it’s necessary.
I’m going to take careful measurements for the bridge placement.

The finished project should resemble an LTD EX-104 except with a natural clear finished neck.

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If you're using something like the bridges above - you should be right with a normal drill and being careful - have done it so far with a couple of basses with no issues. Check out the how to place a bridge for a bass guide here: http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...ead.php?t=3048

Good info, thanks! That’s a great thread. I’ll head to Harbor Freight and get some clamps this weekend. I watched a guy on YouTube whip out the hand tools and fearlessly got this kit together with a hand drill so I’m pretty sure I can do it ok.

I might hold off and finish the whole body then drill the holes. One of the Pit Bill videos recommended doing that to prevent wood swelling from wet sanding which makes sense.

For some reason, I’ve been overthinking this build. I just need to get sanding, spraying, and sanding!

You can pre-drill as some of the finish will go down the holes to assist with reducing chance of swelling under wet sanding. It just needs to be lightly re-drilled once final polish has been done and this helps avoid some of the surface scratches that appear when lining up hardware for holes to be drilled later on.

I'd only pre-drill the holes that you really have to, like the bridge fixing ones, where you really want to get that all sorted before you put any finish on. My experience of holes is that regardless of any finish that may have gone down there, they are still prone to water getting in when wet sanding, resulting in the wood swelling up under the finish and often cracking the finish. If you don't wet sand with water, or use turps or white spirit to wet sand then it's less of a problem.

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Originally Posted by Simon Barden

I'd only pre-drill the holes that you really have to, like the bridge fixing ones, where you really want to get that all sorted before you put any finish on. My experience of holes is that regardless of any finish that may have gone down there, they are still prone to water getting in when wet sanding, resulting in the wood swelling up under the finish and often cracking the finish. If you don't wet sand with water, or use turps or white spirit to wet sand then it's less of a problem.

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Thanks, Simon. Its all coming back to me now. Back in ‘85 or ‘86, I recall buying an inexpensive bass...I think it was a Cort. There was a big massive Peavey bridge on sale at the music store shortly afterward that I also bought. I recall figuring out the new bridge placement after carefully studying where the old bridge was. I swapped it, no problem and I set the intonation and action easily. I was just a kid...no instructions, nothing. Just common sense. I do recall screwing the wood screws in with NO PILOT HOLES. It’s a wonder I didn’t split the wood, but I did not.

So...step 1 for me is to get a quality finish on the instrument. I’m not worried about drill presses or bridge placement as much anymore.

I live in Houston, TX and right now it is so hot and humid, spray painting anything would probably be disastrous.

Ok, here is an update: I’ve made NO progress, haha! Ok, I’m thinking about beginning. No, I’m beginning to think about beginning. This is pathetic.

Ok, I’ve built this guitar about 10 times in my head and believe I finally have a solid build plan. Last weekend I read the Guitar Finishing book from Stewart-MacDonald. I bought a lot of stuff too:

1. Naphtha to degrease and de wax the wood
2. Mineral spirits to remove any silicone left from the saw blades.
3. Ammonia to be mixed with water to clean the naphtha and mineral spirits.

Ok, that’s what the book says for wood prep before beginning.

Here’s this weekend’s plan:

Clean the wood, sand and sand some more stopping at 220 grit so the sealer and paint will have something to “grab” onto. Use grain filler, sand some more. Use sanding sealer, sand some more. Only after close inspection will I spray the first color coat.

Sound ok?
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There’s a 3 day weekend approaching and I hope to get the color coats on then. Stay tuned...

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Originally Posted by MusicStudent1

Sound ok?

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If you are going to sand it , I would skip 'cleaning it first'.

cheers, Mark.

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Originally Posted by king casey

If you are going to sand it , I would skip 'cleaning it first'.

cheers, Mark.

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Dan Erlewine recommends doing that before doing anything. There is a fear of SILICONE in the guitar world. It’s probably irrational but allegedly silicone from tools may have gotten onto the raw wood during manufacturing and this is the way to remove contaminants.

Ah...what’s the harm....though probably totally unneeded. But you use 3damp rags in order, naphtha, mineral spirits, ammonia and water.

I tell you, I’ve way overthought this project and need to just start on it! (Work is getting in the way!)

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Originally Posted by king casey

If you are going to sand it , I would skip 'cleaning it first'.

cheers, Mark.

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Totally agree.

All the cleaner, to clean up a cleaner, to then clean up the prior cleaner????? Overkill buddy, just get on with it.

I usually start with 80 grit paper to make light work of removing the factory machine marks which is always quite stubborn on the end grain and side edges which may require sanding with the grain initially before sanding across in the direction of that part of the guitar.

Next up 120 grit and sand it as hard as you can with this level of grit and bring it up as smooth as possible. Once it feels as good as it can get, stop and time to inspect your progress and maybe 1st time to damp things down with one of those 3 products, mineral turps would be my choice. All this damping down will prove is if there are any well disguised glue or filler spots to work on but it sound like you are running with a solid colour so maybe no point as that is only beneficial if seeking to do a stain finish.

Next step, 180 grit, moving on to 240, 320 perhaps. Never done a solid colour and this is where my part of the journey ends and wish you well with the remainder.

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It has taken me FOREVER to begin, but I am happy to finally start! Happy weekend!

I like it... looks to me as if you are doing a job which requires a mask inside the house. Presumably you aren't married.
Or you are very, very brave.

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Originally Posted by Andyxlh

I like it... looks to me as if you are doing a job which requires a mask inside the house. Presumably you aren't married.
Or you are very, very brave.

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Ha ha! I must be very brave because my wife is the one who took the photos! She is a good sport. I wear the mask because the sawdust really gets to me. I’m working on the project in the garage.

I just finished about an hour sanding the neck and body with 150 grit. Then I went another hour with the 220 grit. I plan to dampen the wood as recommended tomorrow and keep at it with the 220, then 320. I am surprised at how soft the wood is. After all that sanding, I don’t really notice much of a difference. There aren’t many dings or machine marks any more but the paper is sure scratching the wood even at 220 grit. I am block sanding and going around all the edges without the block.

This reminds me of building pinewood derby cars with my son when he was in Cub Scouts! Good times! (He is 21 now.)

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Then, it’s onto Grain Filler!!
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Then, more sanding, then more grain filler, etc. etc.

Actually, this is fun. I’m having a good time so far.

Another EX1! Have fun man :)

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Originally Posted by MusicStudent1

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This photo made me LOL.
Not laughing at you MusicStudent1, laughing at myself.
I mow the lawn without shoes, don't own any eye, hearing or lung protection. After I got a welding flash I did start using a welding mask. Now in my twilight years I may change my name from Cork Sniffer to Di*k Head :-)

I can relate to that. Qualified with a Cert IV in OHS and usually whipper snip & mow the lawn wearing Qld Safety Boots (thongs). Wear glasses so that will do for safety goggles, and pop some earbuds in the ears to hear iPod above noise made by the mower. No good on the whipper snipper as it's db level is off the dial and iPod volume control can't beat it. Not a fan of dust masks as they tend to fog up my glasses so I do all the messy stuff outdoors and try not to breathe in any dust or fumes. That pretty well sums up my PPE checklist!

The parts have been sanded and sanded to the point where I think it’s enough. If anything, I bet I overdid it. I made this “Drying Area” today. It’s not really a spray booth. I’m going to do all spraying outside and the neck and body will just hang to dry in the garage in this little tent I made.

You guys may laugh but I mainly made it to practice drilling pilot holes with my hand drill for the neck and bridge. I haven’t used the hand drill in years and used wood screws to fasten it together after drilling pilot holes.

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This will be tested this evening when the parts are coated with grain filler and hung there to dry.

You know, by the time I get the hang of this, the project will be over. I should build another kit right after this since I’ll know what I’m doing a little more by then (I hope). Maybe an EX guitar kit to match the bass....Hmmm.

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Originally Posted by MusicStudent1

The parts have been sanded and sanded to the point where I think it’s enough. If anything, I bet I overdid it. I made this “Drying Area” today. It’s not really a spray booth. I’m going to do all spraying outside and the neck and body will just hang to dry in the garage in this little tent I made.

You guys may laugh but I mainly made it to practice drilling pilot holes with my hand drill for the neck and bridge. I haven’t used the hand drill in years and used wood screws to fasten it together after drilling pilot holes.

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This will be tested this evening when the parts are coated with grain filler and hung there to dry.

You know, by the time I get the hang of this, the project will be over. I should build another kit right after this since I’ll know what I’m doing a little more by then (I hope). Maybe an EX guitar kit to match the bass....Hmmm.

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Why not, that is exactly what I did. Both bodies are exactly the same size, pup routs and control cavities are in different places, and obviously different sized necks too.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

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I am somewhat trying to replicate my favorite guitar from my youth, the 1986 Washburn “Ace Frehley” model AF-40V with my proposed builds. The EX kits are as close as I can get, so I’m going for a gloss black/silver look which is what my old guitar was.

That is a guitar that was built once and probably never will be again. It’s sort of a left hand Explorer shape and was very ergonomic. Sat in your lap, no problem. No strap needed when sitting, access to all 24 frets with a big chunky neck, I loved it and shouldn’t have sold mine.

Your EX instruments are very well done! I didn’t realize the body was the same size for both guitar and bass. Great workmanship. I just finished another midnight sanding session and wiped everything down with mineral spirits to prepare for grain filler.Attachment 28441

That Washburn does look a bit like a butchered Lefty Explorer. Explorer shape is surprisingly ergonomic considering it's rather long and angular shape. The EX5 is very, very neck dive heavy and suggest locating the strap button in the middle of neck mounting plate as I have done recently. If placed on the upper horn/lump I found it wanting to drag down all the time and couldn't seem to find a balance point. All good now. Guitar is not such a problem as the neck is way shorter but I may still get around to relocating strap button too.

In case you were interested in doing a matching guitar here are the comparison shots taken late Jan 2016....
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Originally Posted by wazkelly

That Washburn does look a bit like a butchered Lefty Explorer. Explorer shape is surprisingly ergonomic considering it's rather long and angular shape. The EX5 is very, very neck dive heavy and suggest locating the strap button in the middle of neck mounting plate as I have done recently. If placed on the upper horn/lump I found it wanting to drag down all the time and couldn't seem to find a balance point. All good now. Guitar is not such a problem as the neck is way shorter but I may still get around to relocating strap button too.

In case you were interested in doing a matching guitar here are the comparison shots taken late Jan 2016....
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I’ve always liked the Explorer shape but whenever I played one, it just didn’t fit in my lap. I remember Ritchie Stotts of the Plasmatics playing a light blue Ibanez Destroyer II back in the early ‘80s and always thought that’d be a cool guitar to have. Building a replica of the Destroyer II would be a fun project. I probably wouldn’t modify the body, but maybe that’s not that hard to do with a coping saw and some sandpaper. I don’t like the rhythm pickup being too close to the neck problem, though...

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I am expecting neck dive, so thanks for the strap button tip. The BC Rich players have reported the same solution to neck dive with their guitars. I am ready to deal with it and plan to use a strap while playing seated. I’m going to work around the bass’s shortcomings because it looks cool, and I am dedicated! Ha ha!

Thanks for the comparison photos. I think you answered a question I had about the EX-5 fitting in a Pit Bull hard case. I believe it’s probably their largest solid body bass and aren’t sure it’ll fit. It looks like it isn’t that much larger than the EX guitar so I’m guessing, yes. After all this work, the thing is going in a case! (Unless my paint job ends up looking like a two year old painted it with a water color set!)

Here are some lessons learned:

1. Clean cotton cloths fresh out of the washer and dryer still contain detergent soap! That fact probably doesn’t do anything but I realized I was wiping my body and neck with sudsy water to raise the grain. I rinsed the cloths, wiped again, and sanded a bunch more when the wood dried so I doubt any soapy residue is left anywhere.

2. Stew Mac grain filler should be mixed with water. That fact is left off the jar but I saw it later on their website. Today, I glopped a bunch of it in the body and neck with a brush as instructed and let it dry. After a few hours, I sanded it back and re applied with water. No harm done, I guess. (There is no question that I’m sanding way more than necessary but sanding seems to cure any mistake!)Attachment 28458

Grain Filler properly mixed with water!

Finding a hardcase big enough in Australia is a problem.
I bought an Epiphone Explorer case for the EX1 and it has lots of spare room, so i placed the EX5 in and it does squeeze in but pushing back the padding around end of headstock and really tight around rear wing too. The headstock was more my worry because if the case took a solid bump that might be just enough to separate that part from the rest of the Bass.
Bought a gig bag on Amazon instead.
If you live in USA check out a Dean case as it should fit in one of them. Just can't get those cases here in Oz.

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Hardcase shots just uploaded under this thread... http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...202#post173202

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Originally Posted by wazkelly

Hardcase shots just uploaded under this thread... http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...202#post173202

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I think I was posting about cases for the EX-5 a year or so ago. Didn’t the website say at one time that the PitBull hard cases will not fit the EX-5?

Will it fit in this case which is currently listed at the Pit Bull store?
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No external dimensions are probably just short of the rectangular shaped length and that does not leave any wiggle room inside.
As mentioned above, i couldn't find anything big enough in Oz but discovered it would fit into a Dean bass case, just can't remember which model?
Judging by price shown you live in USA? You need to find a case with overall minimum internal lenght of 50 inches to 52 inches.
When searching for something i took the bass into several guitar stores to see what it might fit. Not even Epiphone Thunderbird which would have required reshaping the foam in body section of the case.
Gig bag bought on Amazon was about $40 and quite good quality. Cheaper and easier than making my own hard case which would have ended up quite heavy with the bass inside.

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Originally Posted by wazkelly

No external dimensions are probably just short of the rectangular shaped length and that does not leave any wiggle room inside.
As mentioned above, i couldn't find anything big enough in Oz but discovered it would fit into a Dean bass case, just can't remember which model?
Judging by price shown you live in USA? You need to find a case with overall minimum internal lenght of 50 inches to 52 inches.
When searching for something i took the bass into several guitar stores to see what it might fit. Not even Epiphone Thunderbird which would have required reshaping the foam in body section of the case.
Gig bag bought on Amazon was about $40 and quite good quality. Cheaper and easier than making my own hard case which would have ended up quite heavy with the bass inside.

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wazkelly, yes, I live in the US, specifically Houston, TX. Come to think of it, there is no such thing as a Gibson or Epiphone 5 string bass so these are unique instruments. No wonder there are few cases that fit them.

I will find something that fits it, most likely a gig bag like the one you found would do. Do you have the link or name of the one you got that worked?

Oh yes...build progress:

Tonight was about an hour of sanding down dried grain filler from yesterday. Another coat was applied which will be sanded down tomorrow. The plan is to keep sanding, reapplying grain filler, sandinge, etc. etc. until it is freaking smooth. I can still see the lines where the different pieces of wood were glued together. That’s going to show up so I figure I’d better get rid of that at this stage, then it’s on to some coats of sanding sealer and more sanding.

Body and neck drying after the 2nd coat of grain filler for the body and 3rd coat for the neck:

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Once I’ve gotten the parts smooth and sealed, I’ll drill the holes for the bridge, neck, and maybe even the tuning machines. I need to do another test fit because I wouldn’t be surprised if the neck won’t fit onto the body any more. It was a very good fight fit right out of the box and I got grain filler on the neck heel.

That’s the game plan. Is there anything I should know about drilling pilot holes for the tuning machines? I’m guessing I need a tiny drill bit. Any input is welcome. Working on this is fun so far.

Here is the link to eBay seller for the gig bag. So long ago that I thought it was bought on Amazon.... https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/20mm-Gig...REXK:rk:1:pf:0

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Pilot holes for the tuners are very small indeed. Best to line up a screw with intended drill bit to make sure that centre core of screw is same or similar thickness to the drill bit about to be used.

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Originally Posted by wazkelly

Here is the link to eBay seller for the gig bag. So long ago that I thought it was bought on Amazon.... https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/20mm-Gig...REXK:rk:1:pf:0

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Pilot holes for the tuners are very small indeed. Best to line up a screw with intended drill bit to make sure that centre core of screw is same or similar thickness to the drill bit about to be used.

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Hey wazkelly, that was very nice of you to look that up and send it to me! Thanks!

Hey, I’ll probably go with that.

I’m on the 3rd coat of grain sealer for the body and 4th for the neck. Slap it on, let it dry, sand it smooth, repeat. I think it’s about as good as I can get it.

I hope to spray everything with sanding sealer tomorrow, sand, spray, sand, spray, etc.

I tell ya...I’ll feel like I’ve gotten somewhere when I get the 1st nitro color coat on!!!! That’ll probably be next week at the earliest.

Right now, I feel like I’m spinning my wheels hand sanding for hours on end like this. The body and neck are very smooth now but everything LOOKS like I just took it out of the box! No worthwhile photos to post, ha ha!!

It is not a sprint race, more like a marathon.
Slow and steady will pay off in the end.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

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I think I’ve found a tool to safely drill tiny pilot holes...a “hand drill”. The thought of a big heavy power drill or a drill press near a guitar I’ve worked hours on to get smooth and perfect does not compute! My apologies to the builders who knew about these tools already.

These are used in building Tamiya model kits, BTW!

Here are some observations:

1. Any damp cloth you use to wipe down your guitar is going to contain trace amounts of surfactants from the laundry soap used to wash the cloth. I just tried rinsing, wringing, rinsing over and over. And I still see suds in the little dish I use to squeeze the water into. Apparently this either does nothing harmful or most likely helps anything water based adhere to the wood.

2. I’m pretty sure I’ve been applying grain filler, sanding it off, reapplying, sanding again, over and over. Same with sanding sealer. It seems the best way to use these products is to sand really lightly because after about 10 hours of cumulative total sanding between coats over the course of a few weeks, my kit looks only marginally different than when I first opened the box, ha ha! Maybe all that work will pay off with the first color coat.

3. I’m debating whether or not to apply a Krylon white primer coat once I’m done with the sanding sealer. That stuff is pretty good and I think in order to see a smooth surface, that’s going to be a necessity.

Since my EX-5 kit doesn’t look any different, there’s no point in posting photos. Will post when something significant happens.

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Quick question...anybody use Stew Mac’s Sanding Sealer? I’m letting the stuff cure for days after spraying, warming the can before spraying, shaking it, etc....then, I go to do a light sand with 320 grit paper, after a full cure and it all seems to come off!

Check out the neck after a coat last night. This is the 3rd coat for the neck. Obviously I was down to bare wood because I raised the grain when I sprayed the sealer. You can really see it in the neck photo especially if you enlarge it. The body seems almost passable but I’m sanding to bare wood in spots there even though I’m being careful.

I’m about out of the stuff so I’m thinking about using black color nitro next as a primer coat..unorthodox but it’s either that or use automotive primer. I’m not satisfied with the smoothness of the wood. I’d like to prime with a color, sand, repeat, etc. until the surface is smooth. I wasn’t planning to sand the 1st color coat but can tell if I sprayed it now, it’d look bad unless I used thick coats of clear afterward and that’s not what I want. The sanding sealer was supposed to be a smooth barrier coat but it’s not working hence the idea of using black lacquer as a primer and barrier coat.

Thoughts, opinions? I’m guessing you guys are going to say 320 is to course but everything I’ve read says keep it at 220 so the lacquer will “bite” into the wood. 320 is finer than what’s recommended so I’m going to have to think about this some more.

I haven’t used sanding sealer before, but my understanding is it will come off and leave just the pores filled and level with the surface. Some one will correct me if I’m wrong.

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Originally Posted by Fretworn

I haven’t used sanding sealer before, but my understanding is it will come off and leave just the pores filled and level with the surface. Some one will correct me if I’m wrong.

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That's my understanding too - I only used it once before on a table I re-finished, and I sanded it right back to wood. It came out really well.

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Originally Posted by JohnH

That's my understanding too - I only used it once before on a table I re-finished, and I sanded it right back to wood. It came out really well.

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I'm sure the sealer is working as intended. I sanded it this morning with 320 grit, wiped it down with mineral spirits and finally have the 1st primer coat on! Finally, some progress!

I used Krylon white flat spray primer. That stuff is good. I intend to sand probably over 50% of it off before the first color coat.

I primed the body and neck this weekend. It turns out, I used the wrong primer so now I am stuck with acrylic Krylon. My primer isn't compatible with the nitro lacquer I'd intended on using so different paint was bought today. I did sand the body very smooth with 320 grit paper:

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I found that mineral spirits melts my new primer so the wiping with mineral spirits phase is over. I live in Houston, Texas and sprayed outside today and got a pretty bad orange peel in spots due to the humidity. I think some rough spots are maybe not orange peel but raised wood grain because they're in areas where I sanded the primer down to bare wood. Since I'm not using explosive nitro anymore, the next coat will be in my paint booth in the garage. I'll be wearing my paint mask with the filters.

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These photos are deceptive....the body looks bad. I am disappointed.

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I'm going to let it cure for 72 hours, sand smooth, and wait for drier weather. Then, I'm probably going to recoat using a fresh can of paint in my little garage paint booth.

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I'm a little disappointed but I know this can be fixed. Wet sanding, re spraying, clear coating....I'm looking forward to the part where I break out the screwdrivers and soldering iron!

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The body looks dusty but it's been scuff sanded with 400 grit paper and wiped with a naphtha soaked cloth. It's smooth, dry, and ready for another coat. Normally, most don't sand the color coats but I had rattle can spitting, orange peel, and raised grain issues on the first try due to bad weather.

I'm thinking about dehumidifying my paint tent with a hair dryer and spraying in there while its temporarily hot and dry.....if it's stupid but it works....it's not stupid.

I learned wood is not like metal or plastic. If you prime then sand, you can't sand through the primer coat or the grain will raise! I did not know that before this journey into instrument construction, lol!

The game plan is to spray, sand, spray, sand, repeat, until this thing looks good. I don't want to bury it in paint. The idea is to get a thin high gloss finish so the wood can breathe and resonate like the quality instrument it was meant to be!

The neck back will be finished in semi gloss like a BC Rich Ironbird Pro (I think I played an Ironbird Pro in a music store with a matte finished neck a few years ago...that was brilliant!...) the headstock will be gloss black. The chrome is going to be anodized...that's going to be interesting.

The neck is ready, I just need dry weather...more soon my Aussie bretheren!

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Spraying in the little tent avoided the spitting problem. I only got a few runs and some wrinkling to sand out. I think I'm going to spot spray the areas I have to sand instead of re coating the whole thing.

I hope that the clear coat will smooth all this out....we shall see.

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As a player, I’ve always wanted a smooth flat / matte or satin finish on my neck....now I’ve got it!

The first two color coats of acrylic lacquer looked bad and I took 400 grit paper and sanded and resprayed. It looks like the 3rd time’s a charm (or however that saying goes...). This afternoon after work I repainted the neck satin again and the body high gloss. I still had some drips at the neck joint but I think I can fix that with spot painting.

The weather has been below freezing so no progress has been made in a week or two. I am looking forward to clear coating and polishing this thing but am happy it looks ok so far: