Confused on 2H 2V 2T

[fender3x]

I am not sure this makes any difference, but I would certainly like to understand this...

I am a bit confused by the difference in the chart at Guitar Electronics and PitBull...

In the PitBull wiring guide for 2 Humbuckers 4 pots and a 3-way switch The hot wire to the V pot is connected to the left lug of the T pot, and the cap is attached to the center lug on one side, grounded on the other.

https://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-co...m4Pot%20v5.pdf

In the guitar electronics diagram the cap is attached to the hot lug on the V pot at one end and the center lug of the T pot on the other, and the left lug of the T pot is grounded.



I don't think I understand the difference. I there a sonic difference? Electrically, I think this just means that they are in series, but in a different order? GE has cap first, then resistor, PB has resistor first then cap. Is that right?

[Sonic Mountain]

It's one of those things where there is more than one way to skin a cat. There are actually more than 2 permutations for 2 HB 2 V 2 T and they all do things slightly differently.

Here is a good article on the difference between traditional 50's style and modern. I haven't compared diagrams, but from memory the Pitbull diagram is similar to the 50's style and the guitar electronics is similar to the modern style.

I am still getting my head around the electronics side. I can make a guitar work no problems, but all of the different permutations are still a little confusing.

https://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/t.../lespaulwiring

EDIT: Actually, both of the LP styles in that article are different to the Pitbull one, particularly the way the caps are treated. Maybe Wierdbits will or Doc will have some better input on this one.

[fender3x]

These both treat the cap like the GE diagram. The PB diagram is like the modern, but to me it looks like in the ones from SD website and the GE site all put the cap first then the resistor (pot).

The PB one looks like the modern to me, but with the resistor (pot) first then the cap.

I think I want modern wiring, but not sure whether the cap-pot order makes any difference in the sound?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Tapatalk

[WeirdBits]

Pot->Cap->ground or Cap->Pot->ground are effectively the same, the difference being with the latter you save a length of wire as the cap itself is the link between the volume and tone pots. How much would that add up to in a year's production?

The config of the tone pot itself, as in what you connect where, is a mixture of personal preference, habit, and what you've been taught. Some use the middle lug as the path to ground (via the cap if it's pot then cap), others prefer to ground the outside lug. I tend to connect the signal to the tone's middle (wiper) lug as if the wiper fails it should go open circuit, thus disconnecting it.

The 'modern' vs '50's/vintage' tone wiring is essentially which lug it connects to on the volume pot and how that affects the sound. 50's wiring has the tone connected to the 'out' lug of the volume pot (usually the middle lug on an LP). This helps to retain the highs as the volume is turned down and, to some ears, produces a more defined, complex and clear sound. The price for this is that the volume and tone are more interlinked... adjusting the volume affects the tone and adjusting the tone affects the volume, to a degree. So you can end up doing a lot of knob fiddling erm.

Modern wiring connects the tone on the 'in' lug of the volume pot, which eliminates the vol/tone interaction of the 50's style and can simplify things a bit. However, this also comes at a cost, as when you turn down the volume some of your highs can bleed through the pot's reduced resistance to ground, giving you a muffled/muddier sound. This is why treble-bleed style mods are sometimes added to the volume pot to allow some of those potentially lost highs to bypass the volume and go straight to output.

But, as always, two people can listen to the same thing and hear something completely different... or no difference at all. Try both ways, see what you like or what works for you on a particular build and go with it.