This has been a really interesting discussion. Very thought provoking.

I have spent much more time with Fenders than Gibsons, and it seems to me they are very different. Gibson is an older brand, and feels much more like a traditional musical instrument to me. They made working musician's instruments as well as beautiful pieces of art, but it always seemed to me that they were made to play.
I've had more Fenders, and mostly the genius of them is the combination of playability, the ease of actually making/fixing them and their simplicity. Bodies don’t have “archtops.” Parts are mostly stamped and screwed on. But they will take amazing abuse and still sound and play well. Most Fenders are essentially designed to be cheap guitars to produce and maintain, yet be tough, cool and playable enough for working musicians.

So where does a guitar get its value? And where does it NOT get its value from?

One way to judge value is by what some shmuck will pay. From time to time this is why I think about selling my ’75 Precision. It’s a very good bass. Plays well. Sounds good. Made in the USA. All original with orange fur case and ashtray covers. Translucent chocolate brown finish. I paid $275 for it in 1978. When I started seeing them go for over $1700 US on ebay I stopped playing it and started thinking about selling it. It’s good. A brand new G&L LB-100 can be purchased between $1000-1300, and is better in every objective way.

By contrast, my ’85 Japanese Fender F-265C is a great little acoustic. Bound, mahogany sides, back and neck. Bound with a cutaway. Sounds good. Looks good. Plays well. I paid $500 for it new, and will never see that money again. 30 years later it sounds better than new, but no one is going to give me anything for an old Japanese acoustic fender.

If value means to you “holds it’s value” or “appreciates” then patriotism is not the only reason why someone might buy an American guitar. It’s not what I care most about, but it’s not trivial either, particularly if you want to sell or trade someday. I keep my guitars a long time, but for those that sell them, I can’t begrudge this as a criterion. That said, it’s got to be both old and cool to really hold value. You’re lucky if what comes out of the Fender custom shop holds its value. I can’t see it appreciating like the old ones do. Laklands, or Sadowskys or PRS’s might, but it’s a crapshoot even though they’re really good and USA made.

If what you want is a “player” then it’s a little different. I have come to think that there’s a point of diminishing returns. You can certainly pay too much. But to get a good player I generally think you end up paying one way or another. I have an SX Jazz bass (read that cheap-but-decent-Chinese). For $100 it plays as well as most low end Fenders and was finished better than many. Sounded like crap though. No problem! Add good pickups. While I am in there, might as well upgrade the pots and wiring. I’ve replaced the nut with bone (thanks DB!). Done some work on the frets. Will be doing some more. Sanded down the back of the neck. Better all the time, but what I saved in initial investment I am making up replacement parts and sweat equity. I think I’m over $400 and have invested lots of time—with more to come. I had better enjoy the bass, because no matter what it’s not worth a dime more than I paid for it.

Which brings me back to my favorite bass of all time. My ’94 G&L ASAT Bass. partly by CNC, but let me tell you, the precision with which it was put together is astounding. Everything lines up perfectly. The neck is pure joy to put my hands on. In fact I put my hands on it in a shop and never took them off. Came home with me that day. Pickups produce a gazillion different sounds. It’s not so valuable that I am afraid to mod it. It’s built like a tank which is great for gigging. I’d buy another one in a heartbeat, and I’d be willing to pay what they ask.

But I keep thinking about Deadman’s metaphor about the Harley, and a visit that I once made to the Warmoth Factory in Puallup WA (Washington state, not Western Australia). I still had some silly illusions about what “made in USA” meant, until I walked their factory. They guys who were shaping bodies and necks were all Thai immigrants. The owners were locals, but none of the actual workers were. What difference does it make where the Asians who build your guitar sleep at night? Don’t get me wrong, the Warmoth neck and body that I picked up that day are beautifully made. But it’s the QC, not the origin of the part or the worker that makes the biggest objective difference. That said, objectivity only gets you so far. A guitar for many of us is not just something for making art, it is art that you play. A friend who used to race for Honda told me that for a long time he was puzzled about why people bought Harley’s when the Japanese bikes were so much better and cheaper. But one day realized that he’d been missing the point. You could always customize your Harley in endless ways. Beyond that every one that leaves the factory is a custom creation. A Kawasaki is a motorcycle. A Harley is a piece of art you can ride. A new Kawasaki will eventually be worthless. A Harley can go up in value virtually forever.

I want my guitars to be playable and to sound good. On the other hand, I know that a part of why I am spending so much time on this ESB-4 project is that I also want something unique and cool with a little poetry in it. Objectivity only gets you so far ;-)