JohnH's WL-1 (Slightly pre-emptive)

Hey guys,

I'm going to put in an order for a WL-1 kit in a few weeks time, so this is a little pre-emptive, but I wanted to get some advice so I can make a few alterations to the standard kit.

There are a few things I'd like to change. For a start I'm going to ask that the top isn't bevelled. I want to push my woodworking skills and add a veneer (something with heaps of character, like black hearted Sassafras, but hopefully a little cheaper lol). I'm not really that well acquainted with the range of woods available, so if anyone has any suggestions for wood with particular character I'd be really interested to hear them.

I also can't quite decide what to do with the bridge. I'm not really interested in the tremolo bridge, so was going to ask that the cavity be left un-routed. Again though, I don't know enough to know what a good alternative would be? I have seen some great guitars which have single string bridges which I quite like the look of, so was leaning that way based purely on aesthetics. If anyone has used them I'd be keen to hear, or if anyone has any other suggestions?

As for electronics, who knows! I figure I have some time to think about that, but gotta sort out the bridge cavity etc before I can put in the order...

EDIT: Also, has anyone else built one? I've had a search around the forum, but haven't seen one yet.

I only own 1 Rose type trem and I hate it LOL. You could string through the body and just have Gibson style bridge,would look cool too.
My fav guitar to play is my LP Jnr with a wrap over bridge. If you delete the Rose trem on the order be specific and delete the locking nut too, the factory needs things really well explained on Customs

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I also can't quite decide what to do with the bridge. I'm not really interested in the tremolo bridge, so was going to ask that the cavity be left un-routed. Again though, I don't know enough to know what a good alternative would be? I have seen some great guitars which have single string bridges which I quite like the look of, so was leanin

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You could look at something like a Schaller Signum: https://www.schaller-electronic.com/...num-bridge.htm

I am using their Hannes 6 on my TLA-TH: https://www.schaller-electronic.com/...e-Hannes-6.htm

But there are a heap of different options depending on what you like or can bear spending cash on and how much you want to challenge yourself.

Thers always the standard LP style bridge + tail piece, or the six string hard tail bridge like an ST kit.
PBG also carry the BABICZ full contact bridges which are supposed to be the ducks guts.

Hope that helps a bit.

yea, that Schaller is what I have on my LP jnr Frankie. There is also the Hip Shot Baby Grand to consider but might not keep in style with the WL.

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Originally Posted by Dedman

yea, that Schaller is what I have on my LP jnr Frankie. There is also the Hip Shot Baby Grand to consider but might not keep in style with the WL.

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Yup, the cliche Black LP has one waiting for me to finish Farting about with paint. Eventually.

Man, that Schaller Signum is pretty nice. The Hip Shot Baby Grand on the other hand... not really my style, though it's kind of funky.

Trawling the net last night I found these, which I also like: http://www.stewmac.com/Hardware_and_...er_Bridge.html

The Babicz is also pretty cool.

So with those three options I'm pretty well resolved to skip the bridge cavity routing, and then go down one of these alternate paths.

Thanks for the heads up about the locking nut too Dedman, as I wouldn't have thought of it.

It's going to depend on how confident you are in setting up to drill the mounting points.
Schaller do some good templates online to assist with this for most of their standard bridges so that can be a plus.
Several smaller holes drilled with a template can be more easily achieved with basic tools than two larger bore deeper holes like the signum requires. A chunky hard tail bridge or the roller you've found can also hide some blemishes if you don't get it quite right to start with.

It all comes down to what you like and how confident you are to do the work required to fit what you like.

Good advice FW. Luckily the hard tail bridge appeals to me most aesthetically, and while I'm reasonably confident I could drill the holes for the Schaller, it would also stress me out.

In other news, I ordered this great piece of spalted Plane tree online a few days ago and it arrived yesterday.

Attachment 19809

Now I just need to order the kit!

Nice looking piece of veneer you have there.

One thing you would need to do before settling on a bridge is to find out the string spacing required. Hopefully Adam should be able to get the information for you but I suspect it will be a narrow spacing. That Schaller roller bridge is adjustable, but most of the others are fixed width, so you'll need to make sure you get the right one.

It's also worth thinking about getting the Grover tuner upgrade when you order it. If so, I'd stick with the mini-tuners as although you've got a full-sized headstock and the full-sized tuners should fit, the shaping of the headstock means that the tuners all angle-in, and with full-sized tuner keys, it could be difficult to tune without constantly catching the other tuners.

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Originally Posted by JohnH

Good advice FW. Luckily the hard tail bridge appeals to me most aesthetically, and while I'm reasonably confident I could drill the holes for the Schaller, it would also stress me out.

In other news, I ordered this great piece of spalted Plane tree online a few days ago and it arrived yesterday.

Attachment 19809

Now I just need to order the kit!

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Hi John, whereabouts did you order this from? Cheers

Thanks Simon, that's good advice. Even though it seems obvious now you've mentioned it, I wouldn't have thought of either of those things!

JSergeant, I got it from this eBay store: http://stores.ebay.com.au/Curly-Timb...p2047675.l2563

He has some nice stuff on there.

Oh dear god, why, why WHY did I click that link!?!?

Oh no! I've also just clicked the link.... I foresee future cash outflow & timber acquisitions....

I clicked but the extra shipping costs make me safe from its influence.

Ha ha, Simon, I had the complete opposite - one of those rare occasions where I loved the wood AND the shipping wasn't prohibitive. Unfortunately I too can see much of my money winging his way.

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Originally Posted by JohnH

Thanks Simon, that's good advice. Even though it seems obvious now you've mentioned it, I wouldn't have thought of either of those things!

JSergeant, I got it from this eBay store: http://stores.ebay.com.au/Curly-Timb...p2047675.l2563

He has some nice stuff on there.

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Ooooh pretty timber... Thanks :)

Alright, so funds ran out when I first had this idea, but I've been saving up and am nearly ready to order the kit.

Have decided on the following modifications:

- No bridge route
- No bevel on the top edges (so I can add a veneer)
- A 30" bass neck (to fit the neck route, and with a paddle headstock and no tuner holes)

Now I'm looking for suggestions about the electronics. Firstly the pickups - it's clearly going to be a baritone, so I want pickups that will be happy with the low tuning, but really have no idea what I'm looking for. Should I be thinking bass pickups? or active pickups? Or something like these? http://www.lacemusic.com/dropngain.php

Also, since I've been building effects pedals I've been thinking about maybe including some onboard effects. I mostly want to play a lot of drone/doom, so some kind of heavy fuzz perhaps. I did a bit of googling and came across a whole plethora of preamps and other electrical jiggery, but don't really know what to think. Maybe something like this? http://www.guitarfetish.com/Onboard-...one_p_570.html

Anyway, because I'm such a noob I'd love to hear your suggestions for things to think about or include (no matter how wild). Also I'm a sucker for anything that includes a switch, so anything that'll get a switch or two (or three) on the guitar is gunna get two thumbs up (can you tell I'm an artist rather than a musician?)

No special or bass pickups required. Plenty of baritones have used their standard-scale stablemate's normal pickups. Lipstick pickups on Danelectro baritones, Jaguar-style pups on a Fender Bass VI. A Fender Tele baritone a mate had, had standard humbuckers and single coils on it.

The main watch-it on the pickups is that because you are using a longer neck, if the bridge stays in the same location, the standard pickup routs will be relatively nearer the bridge than with a standard neck, so will have a bit less bass in them plus a bit more treble (partially counteracted by the lower tuning).

However, the design of the 30" scale neck is the key to the bridge position. To keep the bridge in the same place, the neck would need maybe 25 or even 26 frets (or some blank space for them). If it comes with 24 frets (standard on a slightly shorter scale Warmoth baritone conversion neck), then the bridge would probably need to be moved backwards slightly to compensate. And if you get a 20-fret bass neck (as per the 30" scale PB-30 kit neck) then the bridge will need to move backwards quite a bit further still. With the large central cutaway curve at the rear of the WL1, you may find you don't have enough space to actually fit even a simple hardtail bridge in the right place.

It all depends on the actual length of the neck from the nut to the heel. E.g. if it's 22", then the bridge will need to be 8" away from the neck heel. If its 20", then the bridge will need to be 10" from the neck heel.

If the bridge has to be moved back significantly, then the bridge pickup will be relatively further forward than before, so won't have quite the same level of treble in it.

So I'd say you really need to get a lot of dimension details first. On the WL-1 body you need to know the distance from the end of the heel cutaway to the standard bridge position. You'd then need to find the active length of the 30" bass neck you were thinking about and see if the two dimensions add up to 30" (or very close to).

If the answer is less than 30", then either the bridge has to move back, or the neck will have to be custom made to make that length 30".

If the answer is more than 30", then either the bridge has to move forwards (which is limited by the bridge pickup rout position and you don't want the bridge pickup right against the bridge or it will sound very 'plinky'), or again, the neck will have to be custom made to make that length 30" (or very close to).

Thanks Simon, this is really helpful. I had figured I'd need to move the bridge back, but I guess I hadn't fully considered how much farther back it may need to be. I'll email Adam, and do some calculations. I had also wondered if the nut width would be a problem, adding the extra two (admittedly thinner) strings.

I'm not averse to the idea of making my own 26 fret neck if it comes to it (or even keeping this kit as a standard scale and maybe later ordering a custom SGB-30 kit to be converted to a baritone)

It may work, it may not. Just can't tell without the measurements. The WL-1 kit has a 24 fret neck as standard, so the end of the neck pocket is already that bit nearer the bridge than with a 21- or 22-fret neck.

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Originally Posted by Simon Barden

It may work, it may not. Just can't tell without the measurements. The WL-1 kit has a 24 fret neck as standard, so the end of the neck pocket is already that bit nearer the bridge than with a 21- or 22-fret neck.

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Yeah, for sure. There's no real drama if it doesn't work out - happy to have a low-tuned standard scale guitar too. Glad you put me onto it though; possible crises are always best considered early rather than later.

That's why we're here! :) We can't always bring good news, but it's better to be forewarned than disappointed.

I suddenly realised that I could tell you how far back the bridge would have to be from the last frets using the StewMac fret calculator.

http://www.stewmac.com/FretCalculator

With the PBG 30" 20 fret bass neck, the bridge would have to be around 3.37" / 8.56cm further away from the 20th fret than the current bridge position. As this is over half the current 24th fret to bridge position, a quick guestimate (looking at a picture of the body) would certainly put at least part of any bridge over the cutout. And the 'bridge' pickup would be along way from the bridge as a result.

Working backwards using the fret calculator, you'd need a 28-fret neck (or equivalent neck with less frets and more empty fretboard to the neck heel) to keep the bridge in the same place. A 25-fret neck (or equivalent length with fewer frets) if you moved the bridge back 1" /2.54 cm, the maximum I'd think practical.

A standard bass neck could be made to work with a slight adjustment of the bridge position i.e. get a standard fretless neck fretted for 30" scale, but I then feel that such a long neck would certainly make the guitar very neck heavy indeed. Yes, you can certainly cut down the paddle headstock to a much smaller shape, which will help; but I don't know if that would be enough.

Yeah, I think you're right Simon. I did a quick mock up last night using photoshop and the fret calculator at FretFind 2D (http://www.ekips.org/tools/guitar/fretfind2d/). Definitely too neck heavy, and the bridge is problematic to say the least.

That's ok, I should have thought about it more carefully to start with lol. Guess I'll have to go back to my original plan of a low tuned standard!

Well, the kit’s ordered! Should be here in the May/June shipment, so I’ve got some time to look at electronics and hardware.

Final modifications are as follows:

- No bevel on front of body
- No control cavity or tremolo route
- No holes drilled for volume or tone knobs
- Paddle headstock for six in line style, no tuner holes drilled

Can’t wait to get my teeth into it

Kit just came in the mail!

Attachment 27112

Doing a quick run through now to see what's what. Bit tricky with both kids trying to 'help' lol

Pointy guitars are so silly. I love them.

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Originally Posted by Sonic Mountain

Pointy guitars are so silly. I love them.

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Ha ha ha, 100%.

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Originally Posted by JohnH

Kit just came in the mail!

Attachment 27112

Doing a quick run through now to see what's what. Bit tricky with both kids trying to 'help' lol

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Looks like a locking nut that comes with a floyd trem but no trem on the body?

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Originally Posted by Sonic Mountain

Pointy guitars are so silly. I love them.

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Is this where we quote Paul Westerberg from The Replacements? ("Pointy guitars give you VD")

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Originally Posted by wazkelly

Looks like a locking nut that comes with a floyd trem but no trem on the body?

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Originally Posted by JohnH

Final modifications are as follows:

- No bevel on front of body
- No control cavity or tremolo route
- No holes drilled for volume or tone knobs
- Paddle headstock for six in line style, no tuner holes drilled

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The locking nut may be an oversight, but otherwise it's a custom order just as JohnH wanted. You have to be very descriptive when doing custom orders and mention everything that needs changing: note the recent guitar hollow-body specified as for just a neck pickup, one volume and one tone control, but still came with the pickup selector switch hole drilled.

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Originally Posted by wazkelly

Looks like a locking nut that comes with a floyd trem but no trem on the body?

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Correct. Annoyingly, that one's on me - even after going through my list of customisations a couple of times before ordering, I still managed to forget to let Adam know I didn't need the locking nut. Rookie rookie

Apart from that, and the fact the front has been bevelled slightly, it's all as I'd hoped/expected.

The front bevel was probably the only thing that was really worrying me while waiting for the kit to come, as I want to put a veneer on. There is a slight bevel, but it's very slight and I can plane it down. To be honest I was probably going to have to plane it at least a little anyway to stop the thickness of the veneer from adding too much bulk to the body (it should only add a few mm, but still...)

http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...893609&thumb=1

Locking nut aside, am I misreading your description of a paddle headstock for 6 in line?
That's a 3 a side paddle. Interested to see what veneer you use on this.

Grant

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Originally Posted by neverwas

http://www.buildyourownguitar.com.au...893609&thumb=1

Locking nut aside, am I misreading your description of a paddle headstock for 6 in line?
That's a 3 a side paddle. Interested to see what veneer you use on this.

Grant

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Yeah, they definitely buggered that up. It's not a huge drama though, so I figured it wasn't really worth mentioning. I suspect I'll end up ordering another neck, and using this one for another project so no real drama. At least I can start on the veneer, etc...

The weather in Canberra is insane today, so as we couldn't go out or do anything I spent the day setting up my plane and joining this plane tree timber to make the veneer

https://i.imgur.com/BEuGZxM.jpg

If I had the cash I also would have gone to the BGS to make a router sled to shave 4 or 5 mm off the top of the body, but it will have to wait until next weekend...

So far, so good...

https://i.imgur.com/qbxe5Kn.jpg

Ohh.. very nice...