LH EX-1

Hello,

I'm currently in the relatively early stages of putting together a left handed EX1 (see attached Photo).

It's the first time since I was a schoolboy that I've attempted to self-build a guitar (that one was a disaster as the plan that came in a magazine had a neck with no truss rod and, in my complete state of ignorance about guitars, when I put it together, I was disappointed to find the neck warping off towards one side).

I really wanted to do this for two reasons - mainly because I have a modest collection of guitars, (a Fender Standard Strat, 72 Reissue Telecaster Custom, 93 Gibson LP Standard, '73 CSL LP Custom, Line6 Variax, Ovation Balladeer, Takamine Mini, Squier P-Bass, and a couple of others) but I really know and appreciate very little of what really makes a guitar work, so if something needs doing I don't really know where to start and I figure building my own guitar will help "demystify" guitars for me a little....

Also, I love the Explorer shape but Gibson only made them in left handed form for a very few years and they are incredibly rare and unbelievably expensive, so love the prospect of owning a guitar of that shape.

I play in a grown-ups-who-should-know-better band called HOWL (also pictured - I'm second from the left - the left hander), which is largely made up of parents of kids who are at the same London music school (The Rhythm Studio) and you can check us out on facebook : https://www.facebook.com/howlontheprowl - we gig in London pubs.

Am enjoying my build so far, but keep thinking that at any stage I could go horribly and irreversably wrong... so will probably be asking for lots of help and support (most of which, I expect, will make many of you cringe in horror about how anyone could be so stupid) so please bear with me.

More photos and, no doubt requests for help, to come.....

Cheers folks and a happy 2014 to you all!
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...3-IMG_4257.jpg
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...v43-HOWL-2.jpg

Hi Siziemm, welcome to the forum and think you are the first Pit Bull builder from the UK !
Sounds like you have quite a large collection of guitars and a bass.
The EX-1L looks fantastic, is that carmine gypsy wudtone on the body and a vintage yellow neck stain ?
Ask as many questions as you like regarding the build, the only dumb questions are the ones you don't ask !

Maybe you can start a build diary and people can answer questions there. Post lots of photos and enjoy the build ! Don't rush it, thats when people make mistakes !

Nah Woks! We were flogging some other poor English cricket fan two weeks ago!

But we are a polite bunch, so we won't mention the 5-0 whitewash too many times since we want you to feel welcome Siziemm.

Quote:

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/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from siziemm on January 6, 2014, 05:58
Hello,

I have a modest collection of guitars, (a Fender Standard Strat, 72 Reissue Telecaster Custom, 93 Gibson LP Standard, '73 CSL LP Custom, Line6 Variax, Ovation Balladeer, Takamine Mini, Squier P-Bass, and a couple of others)

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If this is a "modest" collection, I have some more ammunition in discussions with my wife.....

Welcome to the forum Simon, it's great that you can build the EX you've always wanted.

One thing I noticed in your pic is the neck heel. The EX-1 is a set neck so you need some bare wood on the neck heel so you get a good bond when you glue in the neck... otherwise you could have 'catapulting neck syndrome' once the string tension goes on. Sit the neck in-place in the neck pocket and use some low-tack masking tape to mark where the body edge sits around the neck heel. Remove the neck and move the masking tape in around 1/4" (to make sure no bare wood will show) and then use some 80 grit sandpaper to carefully remove the Wudtone from the contact patch of the neck heel. Ideally, you want the heel to look something like this:

http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...cu84-image.jpg

One of the benefits of build diaries is that extra sets of eyes may spot a potential issue before it becomes a problem (the above image is from Bass Guy's lefty EX build diary).

Welcome Simon,

Looking good! Hope you enjoy your build. Start a build thread and keep us all up to date with progress!

cheers,
Gav.

always good to see another lefty Simon, welcome!

Scott! Your eye for detail never ceases to astound me. Well spotted on the neck! Simon, Scott is correct! You need to get that paint off the spot where the glue adheres to the neck pocket and the neck, otherwise you will end up black and blue when that neck raises off the pitch like a Mitchell Johnson bouncer!

Quote:

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/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from wokkaboy on January 6, 2014, 09:30
Hi Siziemm, welcome to the forum and think you are the first Pit Bull builder from the UK !
Sounds like you have quite a large collection of guitars and a bass.
The EX-1L looks fantastic, is that carmine gypsy wudtone on the body and a vintage yellow neck stain ?
Ask as many questions as you like regarding the build, the only dumb questions are the ones you don't ask !

Maybe you can start a build diary and people can answer questions there. Post lots of photos and enjoy the build ! Don't rush it, thats when people make mistakes !

---

Hi,
Could be the flash on the camera making things look lighter, but it should be Cherry Flamenco and you are quite correct, it is the vintage yellow neck stain.

Hi,
Could be the flash on the camera making things look lighter, but it should be Cherry Flamenco and you are quite correct, it is the vintage yellow neck stain.

Thanks also, to Scott and Gavin (I hope I've identified you correctly) for the advice on sanding back the heal of the neck before gluing. I have to confess that putting the neck on correctly is the part of the build that I am most anxious about.

Am going to look at the EX1 build diary that is mentioned and see how that went....

Re: the Ashes Cricket debacle (from a Pom's point of view, anyhow) - hmm, the least said the better. Quite used to us losing, but didn't even really put up a decent fight.... and fair credit to the Aussies for playing extremely well!

Hi Simon

The Set-necks can seem daunting but these great forum members have awesome advice.

In this thread, about 3/4 of the way down the page is the section written by Gavin (with acknowledgements) on bolt on necks. The principles around positioning are relatively the same. Towards the end of the post is also a video on doing a set neck.

http://www.pitbullguitars.com/?page_...iewtopic&t=302

Worth checking out as it may help prevent any issues.

Cheers

Darren

Welcome along Simon - great to have another on board!

Hi. Been quietly getting on with my build over the last five or six weeks. Am now at the stage of gluing the neck on. I seem to have two issues
1) The neck fit seems a bit "loose" ie. there seems to be quite a large gap either at the top or bottom between the neck and the body (it depends which way I move it) it is at east 1mm - will the glue just fill in this gap or do I need to insert some kind of a shim? If so what should I make it out of?
2) and more seriously, even with the saddle on the bridge at its most forward, I can't get the distance between bridge saddle and centre of twelfth fret to be anything like equal to that if the n distance between nut and same point. Neck to centre 12th fret = 312mm. Bridge saddle at most forward position to centre of twelfth fret minimum distance = 318mm
any advice anyone?
I feel both stuck and somewhat worried/disappointed to have got this far and not to be able to go any further without potentially having to really mess up the body to sort the latter problem out, so any help would be greatly appreciated.
Best regards
Simon

I've attached an overall photo of the guitar plus some shots of the neck gaps on my Ex1 and I have an image of my measurement, just in case anyone needs to verify it - which I can also post, off needs be.
Cheers Simon

http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...8d4i-image.jpg
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...j942-image.jpg
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...7b6z-image.jpg

The gap either side of the neck heel in the pocket will depend on the final alignment of the neck with regard to the high and low E strings, and 'squaring' the neck to the body. So, it's hard to know what the gap(s) will look like until the neck is aligned with the E strings positioned evenly with good clearance along the fretboard's edge. If you can get it lined up and gently clamped you can then decide if the gap(s) are excessive before glueing. Neck alignment can also potentially impact your scale measurements.

With regard to scale length, Tuneomatic bridges are angled so your closest measurement to scale should be on the high E with the saddle wound forward. So, just to double-check, you are measuring from the fretboard side edge of the nut to the crown/peak (middle) of the wire of the 12th fret, and then from the crown of the 12th fret to the high E saddle (along the line of the high E).

http://www.dontfret.com/images/measu...h_acoustic.png
http://www.dontfret.com/images/measu...ngth_strat.png

And, this is Gav and Adam showing how to measure scale length on a G-style guitar (it's a right-handed guitar, so you will be checking on your treble side etc)
[embed]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJTQLLnscgg[/embed]

Post back and we'll see what's what.

Hi,
Thanks for coming back Scott.
Re the Gap: totally appreciate what you're saying about the neck (and about scale measurement) but even with the neck squared up, there is likely to be a gap on one side or the other. Thing is that I don't really know what constitutes "excessive"and what I might expect the glue to "fill in".
Re the Neck: Yep, I've been measuring exactly as instructed on the video (I was a little shocked by the disparity and so I checked a couple of my other guitars and,having measured them, the distances there are equal as you would expect from the video). Not so my EX1, I'm afraid. As mentioned,am happy to post pictures of my measurements (I've got a long ruler which makes it clear what's what) but as things stand I have everything at it's shortest from bridge saddle using e string's as suggested and I can't get it to be shorter than 318mm as opposed to the distance between the nut and 12th fret crown, which is 312mm.
It makes me think that either the neck pick up needs to be moved back further or the bridge needs to be moved further forward. But I am obviously loathe to do either because the body will then really be messed up.
Any further thoughts anyone??

Regarding the gap at the sides of the neck, I was hoping aligning the neck would show if it will be a large gap on one side or the other or a small gap on each side, depending on how it needed to be positioned. Then you could assess if it is a glue-able gap, a shim-able gap, or a do nothing gap.

For the scale length, my first thought was that the neck pickup may be preventing the neck from seating far enough into the pocket, but I wanted to double-check the measurements before starting to look for a 'cause'. But, you may as well post your measurement pics anyway as you never know what extra eyes may spot that I've missed..

The next step is to remove your neck pickup and see if you can get the neck seated where you want it. And, if that works, then we can look at the possible options for tweaking the pickup's position without messing up your finish. Gav and DB are the experts so they'll be able to provide the best advice.

Thanks Scott,
AS I recall from yesterday I did remove the pickup, as I thought moving it further back might be the answer, but it seemed to be as far back towards the bridge as I could get it, without having to enlarge the pick up hole backwards. I'll check it out again and come back to you, will post the pictures as well - with and without the pickup in place, so you can see it all for yourself.
Cheers,
Simon

Hi Simon,

In terms of the scale length, I have always had success using the Stewmac Fret Position Calculator: http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Fret...-fretcalc.html. It will tell you exactly where the bridge posts should be in relation to the scale length for a tune-o-matic bridge. Might be a convenient way to double check your horizontal neck position. Has always worked for me.

cheers,
Gav.

Thanks Gav, I'm sure your link will come in handy if I can get into the zone in terms of lengths. But at the moment I think we're still some way off

Quote:

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/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from siziemm on March 7, 2014, 13:59
Thanks Gav, I'm sure your link will come in handy if I can get into the zone in terms of lengths. But at the moment I think we're still some way off

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Here are the images of the measurements - with pickup in place and without. I hope you can see them ok.
With the pickups off it makes very little difference. I might gain a couple of mm but it could be that when the neck is squared off that doesn't come into play. Whatever, I am currently at least 5mm off being able to get the lengths equal and possibly six or 7 mm.
I can only think of one route, at the moment to try, without having to perform major visible surgery on the guitar body.
That is:
1) to file off the back of the pickup cavity by three or four mm and relocate it so that my original drill holes for the pickup screws will still be covered
2) to file off the back of the neck heel allowing me to effectively move the neck further back towards the bridge
3) to cut away part of the front of the pick up surround (leaving the locating screw parts still there but cutting away the section directly in front of the pickup) which would then see the neck butting directly onto the actual pickup. It would not look quite so harmonious but might give me that all important extra few mm.
It will still I suspect be massively tight in terms of length.
If that fails it will be major surgery and will perhaps necessitate the creation of some kind of a scratch plate to cover all of the mess, which would be a great shame in terms of the overall look of the guitar.
If the front pickup he had been located one cm further back I suspect this whole problem would have been avoided.
Any other thoughts/suggestions greatly appreciated
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...r242-image.jpg
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...gqgq-image.jpg
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...esr4-image.jpg

Hang in there Siziemm, I will get in touch with Adam and DingoBass on this one to see what work-arounds there might be for you. My first impression is that the neck pickup cavity might be in the wrong spot. 8mm is 5mm too much. The fix, I suspect, is going to have to take place at the bridge and not at the neck....

My thoughts on this is that you might need to fill the bridge post with a length of wooden dial and then redrill the holes for the posts 6-7mm (to be safe) towards the bridge pickup. This avoids creating the exposed holes at the neck and if you 'paint' over the dial it should barely be noticeable under the saddles.

I expect Adam and DB might be along to offer their wisdom on this once they get on-line.

Hi Simon, sorry I'm late to this thread, Gav called me today and alerted me to your situation.

Taking Gavin's advice, it looks like this is another Lefty that they have messed up the scale length. I don't know why this happens to the Lefties, I assume it's because they don't make many of them.

Anyhoo, your options are to replace the kit (or get the kit back and issue a full refund) under our guarantee. I see you have progressed quite a long way into your build, so I doubt you want to do that.

Or, we can assist you with a work around and issue a partial credit (50% of the kit price) for the factory's error.

The workaround will involve plugging the bridge holes and re-drilling to the correct scale length. Sure, it's a drastic measure, but it's not that difficult and, as we are only talking a few mm, once the bridge is on, I doubt anyone but you will know there is a repair.

I will summon the great one (Dingobass - our resident Luthier) to assist you with the plugging and re-drilling if you want to pursue this option.

If you want to return the kit, no problem, just email me and we'll work it out (adam@pitbullguitars.com).

Cheers

Hi,
Thanks for coming back, and I'm glad to haven't done anything just yet! I don't really want to send the kit back, because I figure I have got this far and I would like to have something to play at the end of the day!
I think I'll have a go at the plugging and re-drilling option and my suggestion is that - providing I've got something that plays,at the end of the day, if you could hold me 50% of a kit price in credit then I could put that towards my next order (looks like I'm hooked, even at this stage!).
I'll await Dingobass's communication as to what to do next - think you've laid out the basic plan, my worry would be making sure the drilling is all set up right, because, as I found once the bridge posts were in, the angle and measurements on those is pretty critical in being able to actually get the bridge on...so a real step by step guide would be appreciated.
Cheers,
Simon

Hey Simon, I have summoned the great one, but he is busy shaping bone nuts and setting up necks. He's aware of this thread and I am sure he will be along shortly to offer sage advice.

You're right, the pugging of the holes is easy, it's making sure you get the right position for the new bridge post holes that is critical.

Hang in there mate and we'll walk you through it.

Hi Simon
While you wait for DB and are forced to listen to the elevator music he plays constantly while the rest of us await our release from the naughty room, i thought I'd mention that you only need to get the bridge placing more or less correct when you drill the bridge post holes . Ideally, you will set the bridge saddles in the middle of the bridge, that is at the halfway mark so that you have the ability to roll 3mm back or forwards. Then you will need to attach the neck to the body. Measure from the nut to the 12th fret, I think you got 313mm, Next, measure from the 12th fret along the path of the bass 'e' string 316 mm and mark this position with tape or a pencil. Then measure along the treble 'e' string 314mm. Join these two points using tape to creat a straight line or mark with the pencil. This line is then your reference point for the saddle. Position the saddle so that the saddles are exactly in line with the pencil or tape line you have created. Make sure the two 'e' saddles are lined up with the point where the strings are to be seated. Holding the saddle in place, you can mark the position of the bridge saddle posts through the 'holes' where the posts will ultimately fit.
Now, if you have a drill press this will be preferred, if not you can use a normal drill bit. But first measure the depth of the saddle post that will fit inside the hole you will drill, then use tape to mark this depth on your drill bit. Obviously, use a drill bit appropriate to the bridge post size. Drill and then fit the bridge posts.

Thanks for that - seems pretty logical. The tape on the drill bit is a good tip, been using that method so far and it's been very effective as don't have a workshop - kitchen table stuff, I'm afraid!

Hi Si.
Been reading this thread and I guess your heart sank a bit when this problem was noticed.
But what I'd like to say is that I had a few hiccups here and there during my builds and, while they were a pain in the ring, they ended up teaching me a lot about overcoming little nasties like this. And when it all comes together you get a stronger sense of achievement I reckon because you didn't just assemble a guitar, you built one.
Hang in there and take heed to the two gurus and and all will be sweet. OM!

Hi
Would it be possible for Dingobass to detail a step by step guide to what I need to do next.
Things that concern me are:
Do a glue the dowls in place?
Will need to have the earthwire for the bridge coming through to the new hole, I think. Any reccommendations on how to best do that? - was thinking about not having the dowl plug the entire depth of that post hole so that the wire will be able to run underneath, does that make sense? The more I think about it, the more it seems likely that I should glue the dowl in place.
Any tips with regards to drilling the new holes? - I was going to clamp the body to a table and then look to drill out a smaller hole and then enlarge it. Any thoughts on how to keep the drill at the correct angle, as I guess that's pretty critical.
Might I subsequently need to spread a little wood filler in at the top, in order to give it a completely homogenous surface where the hole was?
And finally any thoughts on what prep I will need to do the old holes to be able to disguiase them as much as possibles - or how I might make a feature of them which might look quite cool - as I think most of the old hole with the dowl in will be visible as I will need to move the whole thing forward by, I reckon 7-10mm?
Cheers,
Simon

Hi Simon

See my post on the 7th. I think you are only 5 mm out, but follow my procedure in that post. Yes, you will need to glue the dowels in place . Possibly leave them slightly proud of the surface and sand them level. Yes, you will need a 3 or 4 mm drill bit for the earth wire. Protect the guitar surface with cardboard, angle the drill bit and drill from just below the top of the new post cavity into the control cavity. If possible use a drill press. Its the only way to be sure the holes are straight.

Hi Simon,
Gav has set you on the correct path re measurements etc.
I will add this though, when you go to plug the holes, try to find a dowel that is slightly larger than the hole and gently ( or violently if you have had a bad day) tap the dowel into the hole.
A few drops of a good quality glue- preferably an Aliphatic resin type, such as the Pit Bull stuff- will make sure the dowel stays put.

Now, when it comes to drilling the new holes I strongly suggest that you use a Brad point bit.
The reasons being that this type of bit will give you a flat bottomed hole and more importantly there is less chance that the drill will wander off and bore the hole where it wants to, rather than where you want it! Been there, done that ;)

It is rather critical that you get the holes as square as possible.
I would reccommend a slow speed on the drill so you have total control the whole time.

Good luck, and above all have fun!