Hoopers ES-1G Build

Ok, this is my second build and I'm really looking forward to applying some of the knowledge I acquired during the first, which was a TL-1. It had issues a-plenty, but I have a guitar that I love, so cest la vie.

BUT, lo and behold, this kit seems to have the very same problem that the TL did, which ended up being a major source of frustration. The pickup dwells aren't routed correctly!!! Take a look at the image below. You'll clearly notice that the bridge pickup dwell is smaller than the neck pickup dwell. In fact it is physically too small to accommodate a pickup. Seriously?? Is this a common problem? What do people usually do about this?

http://i44.tinypic.com/359zbyq.jpg

Hey Hooper that sucks a bit I've never come across this problem. Do you own a drill like 12-14mm diamter ? I suggest you trace the pickup surround as a guide and drill out the screw hole recesses a bit wider being very carefull not to drill anywhere you shouldn't, clamp down the body with some rags so it doesn't move.
So you have to make the recesses about 2mm wider each side, should be manageable. WOuld be impossible to route it out with the contoured top.
GOod luck and let us know how you go

That's you and me both Wokka....never come across that either. Usually they're a little oversized which means carefull placing of the humbucker rings so that the gaps don't show, but certainly havent experienced SFK's issues. Lightning does strike the same place twice it seems?

Maybe escalate this issue to Adam, SFK. He may want to check back with the manufacturers? Fretworn also seems to have had a similar issue?
http://pitbullguitars.com/?page_id=4...wtopic&t=340.1

On it Gav. Hooper, this is clearly a manufacturing fault and is covered by our Guarantee. Please don't feel obligated to press on. You can return the whole kit and we will send you a replacement. It will delay your build, but I think this is the best option. I will also send you excellent photo tot the supplier and ask them to keep an eye on the pickup routs.

Email me and let me know what you want to do. If you want a replacement I will organise it.

I had a similar issue with a non-pitbull kit, but mine was the other way (up down in Hooper's photo).

I used a sanding wheel on a dremel (actually, $50 wannabe dremel) on low speed (had to be really careful to keep moving so I created a consistent straight line rather than a series of indents). With care, this technique works well.

Hope you get it sorted.

Cheers

Yep, I have come across this one a few times. Part of the joy of building kits! :)

I attack this problem with a very sharp gouge chisel thingy, works every time..
However, unless you have the right tools I would be inclined to go with Adams offer.

I just did a quick check of those same measurements on my ES-1G kit (been sitting in its box for a couple of months waiting for some attention). The neck pup rout is 89mm at its widest point and the bridge is just touching on 87mm, so a bit of variation but within tolerance. Actually, the 87mm rout only just fits the baseplate of my aftermarket pups (with a bit of wiggling), so it seems I got lucky.

It's bizarre that the factory can somehow cut such widely varying routs like on Hooper's kit, I would have thought a set pattern would allow only a 1mm or so difference at most. Unless...

Some one must have punched the wrong values into the CNC. I cannot think of any other reason why this is happening.
Maybe one of our guys who works with CNC machines can throw some light onto this?

Quote:

---

Quote from Analyst69 on June 8, 2013, 14:21
I had a similar issue with a non-pitbull kit, but mine was the other way (up down in Hooper's photo).

I used a sanding wheel on a dremel (actually, $50 wannabe dremel) on low speed (had to be really careful to keep moving so I created a consistent straight line rather than a series of indents). With care, this technique works well.

Hope you get it sorted.

Cheers

---

Because of the curvature of the top of the ES, i would be reluctant to use a dremel or any other router unless you have a lot of experience using them.....

A cheap and easy work around is to get a set of Lino cutting or fine wood carving chisels. You should be able to pick these up for around the $20 mark.

Use the round end chisels to gently and carefully pare away the rout out until the pup sits in the hole and behaves it's self.

My Rick has the same problem and got the chisel. ;)

My TL-1TH had a similar problem. The rounded screw ports (the ears) in the rebates wouldn't accommodate the square screw tags on the pickup base.

In this case I modified the pickups - snicked the edges off the square tags.

Quote:

---

Quote from Gavin1393 on June 8, 2013, 16:21

---

Because of the curvature of the top of the ES, i would be reluctant to use a dremel or any other router unless you have a lot of experience using them.....[/quote]

Good advice, for certain!

And of you did grab the router I'd suggest you use one of these with a template (for those who haven't seen them before).
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...ing-router.JPG

I decided to use a dremmel type bit in my cordless drill. This is the approach I took with the TL-1 and it came out fine. Can't help but be pissed off that two kits have come like this, so am wondering if I go down the Pitbull road for my wife's bass kit. It was clear to me upon opening the box the the two recesses we're not the same width. This annoyance also brings up past angst around the knotty wood near the f-hole on my TL. It was explained to me at the time that somebody decided it was a character-adding imperfection and let it go through, but I think if Pitbull are going to making calls like that then they really need to contact the client and ask what finish is intended, ie an enamel type finish would hide such imperfections, but clear coats would accentuate them. Anyway, rant over. Moving on...

For this ES I'm going with a whitewash look under high gloss clear lacquer. With the gold hardware I reckon it'll look pretty awesome. Here's the masking up in progress.
http://i43.tinypic.com/5vnmut.jpg

Here's the first coat of enamel (yes, enamel!) completed. I thinned the water-based paint 4:1 to make it a little thinner. I wanted to have a consistency that I could rub in with a rag. Hard to see in this shot just how good it came up, but I'm very pleased with it thus far.
http://i43.tinypic.com/i739ma.jpg

What sort of bass kit are you looking at for your wife? My p bass pickguard was spot on with the pickups & no issues with the route - esp given that it's a big hole.

Other thing - Adam has already indicated he'd happily replace the kit if that's what you wanted. I think the guys at PBG take their customer service seriously as evidenced by the speed of responses to all sorts of questions and a clear approach to sub standard kits. I honestly think you'll go a long way to find an alternate supplier with this level of support. That said, the business is still getting going and while unfortunate, I can understand that things may not be 100% - 100% of the time (e.g., Robin's ST-1). As a result, Adam and the crew seem to do the next best thing - rock solid guarantee and service to resolve the issue.

In short, I'd suggest giving Adam an email or a call and going through your issues - I'm sure that something can be sorted out - lightning shouldn't strike twice, but it obviously does - and that sucks, but the lack of other comments (appart from the Rickenbacker) from others with too small / different routing holes, means I don't think that every kit is having this same issue.

PS - your axe is looking nice - the whitewash with gold should be fully schmick!

Yeah, don't get me wrong, I have full respect for Adam and his crew. The concept of the business is awesome and these guys seems to have some real passion. A great little start-up! BUT, that doesn't mean that customers shouldn't winge when things go wrong. They absolutely should. This is how the business gets do develop in a positive fashion. Maybe, just maybe, my comments will inspire a process change to help prevent these problems in the future. That's good for the business and it's good for future customers. There's no point walking on eggshells with this kind of thing. The vendor should know that I was truly pissed off. That way they can develop empathy and truly get why they do the things that they do.

No need for Adam to do anything on this occasion. I've resolved the problem pretty easily myself. It only cost me some time.

For my wife's bass, we're probably looking at the JB-4 or PB-4, in Wudtone T-Bird or Surfer Girl.

Thanks for the feedback. I've given it a second coat which has left just the right amount of grain peeping through. I'm thrilled with it! Can't wait to start getting the clear coats on.

What I'm really looking forward to though is the wiring on this axe. Nice and complex with the super-fiddly f-hole to contend with. Awesome challenge! Found my wiring diagram over at guitarelectronics.com; that site is awesome!

Photo's never come out great with the phone, but here's where I'm at after the second and final base colour coat.
http://i42.tinypic.com/4kb2on.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/2s194m1.jpg

That's cool - just also wanting to let you know that I'm stoked with my PB-4 at the moment - no issues with routing on the pickups. Also fully agree on the needing to let Adam and crew know when there are issues - that's the only way for things to get better.

Gav's done a blow by blow on how to get the electrics into the F hole - if you haven't, make sure you check it out!

Ah, thanks for the tip! Can you link me to it? Cheers!

Gav's got it here:
http://pitbullguitars.com/?page_id=4...iewtopic&t=230

I'm sure he'll be around on the forum soon (ish) this arvo if you have any questions.

Who needs Gav when you got Brendan! Reading the post I was thinking exactky what Brendan has already mentioned! Seems like you are in good hands here! My work is done! :)

Quote:

---

Quote from dingobass on June 8, 2013, 16:13
Maybe one of our guys who works with CNC machines can throw some light onto this?

---

There are two ways this can happen. First way is the file used to cut the body is wrong, but since Gavin said his was ok, chances are the cutter being used in the machine is a slightly smaller diameter than the one the file is set up for.

Btw, I've had the same problem with my brother's es-1g. I very carefully took a couple of mm off the mounting part of the pick up.

Hey skfhooper, I have certainly taken your comments on board and have contacted the supplier to let them know about this issue with the undersized routs. Actually, they've been pretty good so far, we asked them not to use their wood filler and the guitars I've seen in this new consignment, I haven't spotted any wood filler, or holes for that matter.

So, again, sorry you got some kits with a few issues, but you did have the option of sending them back and having them replaced, at no cost to you. This is clearly explained on our site's refund policy http://pitbullguitars.com/?page_id=17.

Cheers

Downside is Adam that you get a bit attached to a lump of wood - even with it's knocks and bumps... :D

I understand Brendan, I'm certainly attached to my wood.

Thanks Brendan. Looks like it will help a lot!

Here's the latest shot, masking off
http://i40.tinypic.com/j5a7i9.jpg

Really looking forward to seeing the end result, neat.

First coat on the side
http://i41.tinypic.com/ed4k5.jpg

Well, this is disappointing
http://i40.tinypic.com/e7o3rt.jpg

Hi SFK,

I have just spoken to Adam. He feels like I do that this kit really needs to go back to the factory with a "Please explain". We know that you have already done a fair amount of work on the body so our suggestion is that you only send back the neck to us.

We are horrified that this neck seems to have passed the Quality Control function at the factory and while this doesn't help your current situation we still offer you our apologies for this failure.

Please send the neck back to us at:

Pit Bull Guitars
Unit 7, 500 Beaufort Street
Highgate WA 6003
AUSTRALIA

Not that we'd miss it, but for Phils' benefit please include your name and address as sender.

We will refund your postage costs and we will arrange to have a replacement neck sent out to you as quick as we can. Please let us know if this solution is not acceptable.

Once again our sincere apologies for the inconvenience caused.

Quote:

---

Quote from pablopepper on June 9, 2013, 14:40

Quote:

---

Quote from dingobass on June 8, 2013, 16:13
Maybe one of our guys who works with CNC machines can throw some light onto this?

---

There are two ways this can happen. First way is the file used to cut the body is wrong, but since Gavin said his was ok, chances are the cutter being used in the machine is a slightly smaller diameter than the one the file is set up for.

Btw, I've had the same problem with my brother's es-1g. I very carefully took a couple of mm off the mounting part of the pick up.

---

My local guitar guru who actually uses a CNC checked over my ST-1 kit before it was put together. He doesn't think it was actually done with a CNC machine because there were too many inaccuracies inconsistent with a CNC job. He thinks it was done with a duplicator, such as those in the pix below. He also suggested that if the "original" body construction was inaccurate or worn, or any part of the duplication process was imperfect, then that would be reflected in the final output. Duplicators would be much a much cheaper way of working than a CNC, which would appeal to Chinese suppliers who are looking to make and sell something as cheaply as possible.

Perhaps Adam could find out whether PBG bodies and necks are made by CNCs or duplicators?


http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...duplicator.jpg
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...ic-guitar2.jpg

yer thats a bummer that neck passed quality control. I just hope the replacement neck fits the body snugly, there's a small risk of the neck heel size being slightly different but most necks I've seen on kits are very close in size

Painting finished. Very happy. On to the top coat.
http://i41.tinypic.com/2nhnx35.jpg

looking good Hooper, you did have a win in another way looks like you dodged the glue on the cap near the edges like some of the earlier ES kits !

Hooper - just read your post on the neck - man that bites... sounds like you ran over a black cat while smashing mirrors on this kit. Sorry to hear that. Hope Adam and the guys get it sorted for you quickly...

sfkhooper, I've tried calling you and no response, maybe you're locked away in your man cave.

We can find no record of you purchasing an ES-1G kit from us; either from our site or eBay. Did someone else buy it for you as a gift perhaps? If so, what was their name (I need this to determine when the kits was supplied to us).

Or, is there a chance you actually bought it from another supplier and genuinely, mistakenly thought it was from us?

The reason I ask is that there is no way that fretboard blemish would get past Phil W, who is a cabinet maker by trade and I'd given him specific instructions to look for faults in the fretboard, as they are almost impossible to repair.

Anyway, if it's not our kit, no problem, I'm sure the others would agree with me that we'd be happy to help you with this difficult build. If it is our kit, then we will certainly fulfill our obligations in whichever manner you prefer.

More importantly, if we're going to have a thread full of images of horrible flaws, I think you'll agree its important we name the correct suppler.

Thanks mate,

Hi Adam, all valid questions, so no worries. It was actually purchased by A.P. (name abbreviated for obvious reasons). You might remember that we work together. It is on order #1882. He traded the kit for a washing machine, of all things, which I was more than happy about. Anyway, I have the docs and can have him chime in if necessary. Cheers!

Well if nothing else at least we now have a more acceptable moniker for "A.P.". :)

Thanks sfkhooper, I did have in the back of my mind that there was something like that going on, but I thought it was your wife/gf who bought it for you. Anyway, with the order number I can now tell the Factory what consignment on, so they can kick the right arse.

So, that is an awful fault on the neck and we need to get you another neck asap.

Not sure you've already sent yours back, but, if not, can you please send it, receiver pays, to:

Pit Bull Guitars
4 Jade Street
Mount Richon WA 6112

(not our Highgate Office)

I'll get another neck off to you tomorrow.

If the neck you have there ha a number on it, let me know what it is and I'll see if we have a matching one. I believe the numbers relate to the machine used or the operator who did the work.

Cheers,

Thanks, Adam. I'll send it off tomorrow. The only number I see is a pencilled "2" at the bottom of the neck. Is that it?