#shed envy#headstock envy.
#shed envy#headstock envy.
Cheers Simon, high praise from someone who does seem to prefer more traditional designs :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Barden
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Heh, thanks Mark, you will note I share my shed space with the Laundry.. it's also my office, studio, D&D room, band practice space etc etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkMark
Expensive computers do not play well with the amount of dust generated in guitar building so there is a stack of compromise going on.
It is great to at least have a space I can use though.
No progress this weekend due in part to being busy with other stuff, but also 40+ temps here. Well outside the safe temps for spraying so just being patient. Don't really want to have to sand back again.
Well, semi-traditional design. I do now have a Firebird and an almost-finished Explorer kit, which although old designs, do move away from the conventional.
Your design combines some elements of both of those as well as new ones, and without being overtly angular like some of the recent Music Man models. I'm liking it.
Cheers man, it was always my intent to make something classic but still different, there are bits from lots of different guitars combined.
So while waiting to apply another clear coat I'm turning my attention to electrics....
*Paging Dr Weirdbits, Dr Weirdbits to the OR*
I'm really making this bit up as I go. I have room for 2 pots and a 3 way switch. I have on hand a push pull A500K vol pot and a normal B500K tone pot, 22uf Orange Drop cap and a suitable jack on the way.
Looking at my 'Wish' pickups, it looks like adding in a split should be straight forward enough. So I'm thinking master vol and tone with the bridge setup to split. I've had a couple of goes at 'virtually' wiring this and I'm not sure I'm going about it the right way...
Open to alternative suggestions as well - this is the core diagram I have if anyone would like to have a go....
https://i.imgur.com/K7MDjrg.jpg
And what I'm looking at out of the pickups
https://i.imgur.com/icfnkug.jpg
What would you like to be able to do with the wiring?
There are loads of options. You could coil split both humbuckers off the push pull but the catch to that is you would be locking into a specific combination in the middle switch position unless you added another component.
You'd either have the ability to do 1 or 2.
1. both split and both humbucker.
2. Humbucker bridge single neck and single bridge humbucker neck.
Other options are things like kill switches, phase reversal, series parallel etc.
I'm no expert but I have learnt a bit researching mods for my Rick scratch build and happy to help where I can.
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I honestly don't know what I want to do specifically and I'm in the same boat, no expert, but I've had success in the past with some different wiring setups. For my own playing I usually put it on the bridge with everything at 10, so it's all a bit superfluous unless I'm feeling whimsical.
The last few I've just done tele style wiring. So I'm thinking the same as that but with a splitting option for the bridge using the push pull.
I'm a bit lost with the amount of wires coming out of the pickups... and best order .. do I setup the switching on the vol pot for the bridge, then route back to the selector switch? .. I can work out one hum bucker.. but not how to incorporate them both into the circuit.
If someone could doodle on the pic above how to accomplish that I'd be eternally grateful.
Looking at your humbucker photo I would guess:
Black = Hot
Red & White = End of Both Coils/Coil Tap
Green and Bare = Ground
Here is a diagram from Seymour Duncan that you could use. This diagram has coil split on both humbuckers but if you only want to split the bridge then just don't solder the red and white from the neck to the push pull. Just put a bit of tape around the bare parts of the red and white wires from the neck pickup so they don't ground out on anything.
Push pull down = humbucker
Push pull up = single coil
https://i.imgur.com/XvOmZhd.jpg
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I did coil splits with 2 x toggles + 3 way for pickup selection and stacked pots for 2 x volume & 2 x tone on my mates Epi Explorer, in absolutely no hurry to do that mix again.
Does sound good though
Ah right.. I think that makes sense to me, the black wire being hot makes it a bit more obvious. Also seems likely they would copy SD.... So the idea of splitting both buckers at once would be cool I think, so I've basically replicated the above diagram.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woltz
How does this look to people with better brains for this stuff? Let me know if you spot anything dumb.
https://i.imgur.com/PeaD5YJ.jpg
And further to the above - would there be any problem with making an 'earth block' as a common earth point?
Mostly to avoid soldering 6 wires to the back of the volume pot. I was thinking a bit of brass in the cavity earthed to the bridge and jack that all the other earths can route to.
Just at a quick glance it looks like you've reversed the push pull compared to the diagram I posted. It's not an issue, you just need to decide whether you want the pot up or down for the coil split.
Also your volume pot is missing a ground on the 3rd connector.
In regards to the single Earth point that should be fine as far as I'm aware.
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Ah cool, cheers. I think I've fixed both those now - exactly why I need an extra set of eyes.
I'd prefer for them to be split when the pot is pulled out and normal when the pot is in, got turned around looking at the diagram.
How's this looking?
https://i.imgur.com/27KNptG.jpg
And here's how I'd do the earth block... I don't think it introduces any shorts?
https://i.imgur.com/Qx9yRr6.jpg
The layout looks good now, splitting both pups when the push/pull is up.
One thing you may want to do before grabbing the soldering iron, particularly with unfamiliar pickups, is to check you’ll be splitting to a hum cancelling pair. It’s easy if you have clips leads. Sit the two pups side by side, clip the two black wires together and clip them onto the ‘hot’ of a jack, clip the two red/white pairs together and clip them to the jack’s ground, plug in a lead and connect an amp. If it’s noisy/hummy then on one pup swap the red/white to the hot clip lead and put the green/bare on the ground lead and test again.
If it’s hum-free with the second config then you will need to change how one side of your push/pull is wired. For one pickup, say the neck, instead of having your purple ground connect connect across to its lug you need to have the black ‘hot’ connect there before going on to connect to the toggle switch. That’ll split it to the other coil.
OK great tip Scott thanks for that and for checking that the above will work. Little ways off putting it together so I'll definitely run through that check first.
Cheers for your help as well Woltz.
You've got a redundant ground wire. There's one from the back of the volume pot to the back of the tone pot that's not needed as you've already got ground connections shown from both pots to the bar.
I'd also consider using a push/push pot rather than a push/pull pot as they are always easier to use. Wiring is the same, just a different mechanism within the pot.
Oh yeah, good pickup on the redundant wire. The push pull is what I happen to have on hand, so that’s what I’m using here.
....watching poly dry. Getting very close, still some pores and slight imperfections. Maybe a couple more coats.
Will probably grain fill next time, I've avoided doing that to this point, but it'd surely speed things up.
https://i.imgur.com/MNRe5q3.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/9JyupvF.jpg
Loving the finish on that Phil
It's driving me crazy. I'm pretty much ready to assemble, but want to get this as nice as possible, which means a lot of waiting around for it to cure before recoating. It'll be worth it I think, but I'm pretty keen to see if it comes together as a decent playing guitar as well.
Nice job mate. The patience has really paid off on that finish. Love the colour.
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Looking good.
If you want to move this into repeatable scratch builds for sale, then you'll need to move into grain filling and spraying. Unless you don't want to charge for your time, then you'll need to use all the time saving measures you can to keep the final sale price reasonable.
You'll also need to think about sourcing a suitable case and/or gig bag.
Yeah, I’ve been thinking about the case situation. I’ll take this one down to my local and see if it fits in any of their generic cases before I do anything in that regard.
I have a long term plan for manufacture that will greatly increase productivity, but at the moment I’m going to persevere with this traditional style approach.
I’m very keen to speed up finishing though , in this particular case the body wood is not an ideal choice. I’m pushing ahead through sheer bloody mindedness. I think it will be worth it for this build, but it’s definitely not a practical long term approach.
Final coats on today! It's been a long wait to get to this point as I have been extra diligent in letting each coat get properly dry before doing the next. There are still some little imperfections, but its as good as I'm going to get with a rattlecan on my back patio.
After a LOT of umming an ahhhing I decided to finish the neck in satin. It looked amazing glossed, but even just handling it unattached, it didn't feel right and I'm sure it would have annoyed me when playing. Plus the frets wouldn't have stayed glossy long. So 90% satin and I'll shoot a finishing coat of gloss over the front of the headstock for aesthetics.
I am absolutely dying to get this thing assembled and see how it plays. So hopefully that's only a week or so away. Woot!
https://i.imgur.com/NzJS6jq.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/FLdJtU3.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/4PZ6QeO.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Pd9hUL9.jpg
Out in the sun for a good bake.
https://i.imgur.com/xxmvHxJ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/BVm8joP.jpg
What's your plan for the string-through holes? Standard ferrules?
I only ask because they look quite small, and I'd be concerned about chipping the the finish when enlarging them.
I drill mine with a small forstner bit, then put a slight taper the top edge of the holes before applying the finish.
That minimises the build-up of finish at the edge, and the ferrule is a bit tight, it just takes a touch up with a reamer or countersink bit by hand to open them up with very little risk of finish damage.
Yeah ferrules. The holes are to size but have a bit of build up in them from finishing, I’ll just clean them up a bit with the dremel.
I've found that getting a finish too hot isn't a good idea. Warm, yes, but not very hot. You could easily get the surface up to 70°C+ on a hot day with a dark colour. I'd put it outside in the shade in a breezy location.
It’s uv stabilised exterior marine grade poly. It’s fine.
Welp, I thought I might be assembling today, but then I went and mucked up the finish on the back while I was cutting and polishing. Bit of moisture in the string through holes led to a slight swell and cut through.
Sigh, totally my fault and one of many I've made tried to finish this godforsaken thing. Anyway, its not too bad, I'm just going to give myself a couple of fresh coats on the back so I can blend the repair edge in on the edges of the body.. so maybe assembly next weekend.
Super annoying but not the end of the world.
I tired a gloss finish on the face of the headstock, but I didn't really like it with the satin, so the whole things is satin now.
I'm very happy with how its come up. I've just done one pass levelling and dressing, mostly to get the poly off. It will need another pass before assembly but so far so good, happy enough for my first ever complete neck build anyway.
https://i.imgur.com/jzFpq3V.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/iJ1UgKY.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/R6GyISu.jpg?1
https://i.imgur.com/OXcfXXK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/1Uho8fU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/iCTIBzh.jpg
Looking good Sonic.
What he said ^^^ ;)
Thanks guys. Driving me crazy sitting around waiting for it to be done drying.
Next one I'm doing in satin, so much easier to get a nice finish.
Looks amazing, love the grain on the headstock!
Bummer about the swelling! Even with being careful you might not get it perfect. Don't know if this is used by others but, I used soft surfwax, that stuff is totally water repelling and gives you a good grease to drive the screws in when finishing.
Honestly just a case of getting a bit over excited.
This has been a bit of a finishing nightmare trying to get it up to the standard I'm after, the actual piece of wood is just not ideal and has presented plenty of challenges.
I'm well over it now, so I'll let this coat cure and then just go ahead with assembly.
Sonic that is a magnificent work of art you've made there. I've been looking and looking and I haven't seen the order form yet! But I can totally see one in my collection of guitars I can't play properly. You should be incredibly proud of this build. And thanks for sharing all the slip ups along the way. Sometimes I wonder if it's just me that makes these blues, so it's great to see that an amazing guitar can be salvaged from some dire situations. Can't wait to see it assembled., so I can only imagine how frustrated you must be feeling.
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I do bee's wax. Timely post, as I just posted about it in another thread yesterday!Quote:
Don't know if this is used by others but, I used soft surfwax, that stuff is totally water repelling and gives you a good grease to drive the screws in when finishing.
I do have some Sex Wax though (it's for surf boards, for all you dirty minded out there) may have to try it someday.
Thanks Guys. Yeah, I'm normally pretty careful with wet sanding since I made this mistake on my first ever build. It's repaired now, not quite perfect, but I'm over trying for that now. I just want to see how the damn thing plays.
AdamC, thanks for that, I appreciate your kind words. Certainly helps with motivation. I always try and share my mistakes, I'm by no means an expert at this game and the best thing about this forum is the shared knowledge base.
I'm pretty much ready to go with Protoype 2 - which should hopefully happen a lot more quickly than this one has. I'm still within my goal of completing V1 in a year, but that deadline is fast approaching. I just want to be sure of the changes I've made to the templates before I get them cut. At this stage I will probably source a piece of Camphor Laurel for the next one as its readily available here, hopefully it'll be a bit more stable than this piece of stringy bark.
I wasn't going to share this for a little while, but here is the plan going forward for some variations on the Deluxster and what will be the Shoegazer MKII. The deep aqua one on the left is essentially the same as this current build, with some changes to the neck pocket and overall size of the body. The one I've called the Sonicaster here is probably really just a Deluxster variant. That's the next build as I have a lot of the hardware already.
Then I'll see where I'm at. The next two are the same core guitars with different body shapes, but I might keep going with this OG shape for a while before I get into those. I'll see how I feel as things progress.
https://i.imgur.com/DTuXmY9.jpg
You took the words out of my mouth. Especially that second sentence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adamc