A weekend work conference. Everyone's idea of fun. Enjoy!
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A weekend work conference. Everyone's idea of fun. Enjoy!
We have them twice a year and they are pretty dull except for the Saturday night dinner where plenty of booze gets consumed. Not me this time as I have cut back as part of my weight loss mission that does not allow for too many drinks nor desserts for that matter.
Never that much fun when all around you are indulging and you have to stay relatively sober.
All good Simon, no longer a teenager so hangovers tend to hit a lot harder and since cutting back to one session per week about 6 months ago, rather than a couple of drinks each night, these days it only takes about 4 drinks for me to start feeling tipsy and therefore time to stop.
Finally got around to working on this again tonight.
Removed the PUP's, measured them against the standard ones and they are 5mm taller. Also realised that I had put some high density foam underneath them to act as a bit of cushioning and guess what, that was about 5mm thick too so easiest job was to remove such and screwed down the PUP's. Whilst I was at it the sunken PUP pole pieces were protruding out the bottom and were easily pushed back into place.
Strung it back up, re-tuned and then proceeded to lower action at the bridge as it was now way too high and no chance of touching the PUP's. Dropped the saddles down onto their bellies as they wouldn't go any lower and whilst still a little bit high on the upper frets it is low enough for where I mostly play. Only required a slight tweak of the intonation and now the G string is behaving itself. On another day or night I will swap over to the Gotoh Bridge as it has more mass plus a bit more fore & aft saddle travel.
Well, couldn't help myself as it was eating at me all day at work today so after dinner proceeded to swap bridges. Here are the before shots...
Attachment 15392Attachment 15393Attachment 15394
Thankfully original mounting holes lined up in exactly the same place for the Gotoh bridge and here are the after shots....
Attachment 15396Attachment 15397
Retuned intonation and all perfect now that there is a bit more fore & aft adjustment room. Had a blast playing this then the EX-5, onto the Ric 4003 and back & forth for an hour or so just to make sure all were functioning properly plus to help get a better perspective on the tonal sound differences between each Bass.
Gotta say, the more I play a 5 string it makes a lot more sense and actually becomes easier to play as you have a bigger spread of patterns in any block position up and down the neck. Pink Floyd's Money is not so easy on a 4 string compared to a fiver and there are plenty of other tunes where using a lower note higher up the neck is not as big a stretch.
Only job/s left on this might be a replacement nut and one of the original tuners on the D string feels a bit dodgy when tensioning up. These jobs will have to wait for another day as they are OK enough for now.
I like it when a plan comes together.
Thanks Simon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Barden
Re-checked intonation after lowering the PUP's and it was still off a bit on the G so as there was very little adjustment room left to work with that forced me into fitting the replacement. Unfortunately the theory about magnetic forces pulling on the strings because PUP's were too high may not have been contributing much to the intonation woes. It could have affected the harmonics a small amount but was too hard to identify and the fretted 12th on the G was still reading off by enough to be noticeable.
Did you find the bottom B string hard to fit through the hole in the rear of the bridge? I've got an 80's Peavey 5-string that I'm refinishing (and is currently part sanded and all in bits). Whilst it is supposed to be from their custom shop, its serial number of 888888 (on a holographic Peavey custom shop label) leads me to think that it might have been a prototype, especially as it was very poorly finished with no grain filling. The bridge is quite robust, with a thick rear bar, but I really had to pull the B string through using pliers and a lot of force.
Attachment 15399
As a result, I want to get a different bridge, but most of that style of bridge use the same sized holes for all the strings - and the same size as all the holes in the equivalent 4-string bridges. This strikes me as wrong. I may also look at rear string mounting bridges, as I'm now happier about drilling through the body and fitting ferrules. But again, all the string ferrules seem to have the same sized holes! It may be time to get the drill out on those as well.
Also, the bottom B sounded very dull indeed in comparison to the other four strings, with far less sustain, even though there was a decent break angle over the nut and bridge saddle. This was with two sets of strings. Is this normal?
I suppose this might be something to do with the pickups, which I also want to change, but they are all encapsulated in resin, so I can't take them apart to see if they might possibly have 4-string innards. It did have active treble and bass controls, but they weren't nice sounding and the overall tone was very growly, so I may first try the pickups in a passive mode in case they can be redeemed, but they will more likely be swapped for some other soapbar pickups.
Hi Simon, my fiver is the EX-5 and bridge looks similar to the one on your Peavey except the holes are big enough to take the ball ends into the base as per this shot. It is the standard PBG bridge that comes with the kit and have seen many that look similar on eBay.
Attachment 15400
I am guessing that it is the ball ends that are protruding as they are doing the same on the Red J Bass as seen in last shot on the lower RHS of that post where the strings used are D'addario. Can't remember what are on the EX-5 and tend to think they are more a mid priced set as I have only been playing it on & off for the past 6 months. Must say that the string holes do seem to have a bigger diameter.
Not sure rear loading would solve the problem unless you can find ferrules big enough to swallow the ball ends. There are some of the top mounted 'claw' styles that might work where the string is brought in through a groove at the back edge.
Low B was quite dull on mine too and reckon that had something to do with the much lower subsonics as it is also much harder to tune with a tuner too. Thickness of string plus string tension are probably affecting sustain too but I found this was more of an issue on open B and up to C and rarely play those anyway.
Swapping to better PUP's made a huge difference and all the strings now have same volume level and tonal clarity. Mine measure 102mm x 40mm and replaced with John Benson Customs for USD $200 plus $20 postage & handling. They had to be ordered via Adam at PBG as a special order and took a couple of months to arrive.
Hope some of this helps and makes sense.
It wasn't an issue with the ball ends protruding, just that the string hole size was too small for the actual B string to go through smoothly. I did go for a heavier gauge of strings than I would normally have chosen, as I'd read in several places that the low B needed to be above a certain size to work well. I can't remember what gauge first got fitted as it was several years ago now but probably 45-135, they were an expensive set of player-named DR strings (maybe Marcus Miller?). They were then replaced by a set of Peavey Cirrus strings (which I was sure would fit as they were designed for the bass!) but had the same issue. I think the biggest problem was where the silk windings went round the ends of the strings - I had to get a knife and cut the silk away as it wouldn't fit through at all without doing that!
Looking at some Schaller 5-string bridge drawings, I see that their string hole diameter is 4.6mm on a top-mount bridge (with a 6mm diameter string ferrule indent) and 4.8mm on a string-through bridge. As a 0.135" string has a diameter of 3.43mm (plus manufacturing tolerances), there shouldn't be an issue (although there is no indication of diameter at the start of the silk windings)
But I'm also a bit limited to the choice of bridges as I think the Peavey has a wider than normal (or wider than Fender at least) string spacing. It's difficult to find details like the hole sizes in string ferrules and bridges from most manufacturers. So I need to find an adjustable width bridge that will fit my string spacing requirements and that I know has a large enough string hole size.
Why can't it be easy?
Hey Simon, all you can do is find the nearest best fit and run with that.
String spacings could be an issue if your neck is quite narrow towards end of the fret board. Never seen or heard of a bridge with sideways adjustable saddles. Maybe these individual bits might do the trick?
Attachment 15432
Some of the Schaller bridges have sideways adjustment. Had problems with getting a better bridge for narrow bass string spacings before, but the Peavey seems to be a wider spacing than standard by a few mm.
I'd thought about individual saddles, but it would then be a case of having to fill in and disguise the existing saddle fixing screw holes. The individual ones would be good on an un-drilled body.
Yeah, just re-checked your bridge and it is anchored with 6 screws and they are positioned either side of the string so those individual ones wouldn't hide the old holes.
Never got past the price tag on Schaller to see what they could or couldn't do. Maybe they are cheaper in UK? Are they still made in Germany?
They still are made there. Which generally explains the higher prices. Still expensive compared to say the average Gotoh bridge, but there is a lot more engineering and adjustability in them.
Can't beat German engineering.
Shipping and exchange rates tend to price them a bit out of reach once they get to this far flung part of the planet.
Still, if you wanted to spend a lot of money on a bridge, some of the ABR ones (another German brand) are about double the price of the Schallers.
Hmmm, quality overkill perhaps where the part could be more expensive/valuable than the rest of the axe.
Don't get me wrong, always believe in using better quality parts wherever possible, but not prepared to spend plenty for negligible gain or functionality as that could be funds better spent on other things, such as another kit or other upgrades.
Found the 5-string bridge and the hole diameter was 3.43mm, so no wonder that bottom B was tight! Bridge spacing is 64mm, 16mm between strings, which is actually slightly narrower than some (I had it in my head that it was wider). My bridge looks exactly like the Allparts economy 5-string bass bridge, which has a 64mm (2-17/32") spacing, so it probably is that one.
All the other fixed spacing bridges I can find are wider e.g. the Gotoh bridge is 68.8mm. Even the affordable adjustable ones will only squeeze down to just over 65mm (which should be acceptable). The Schaller top-loader will squeeze down to 64.3mm. But I'm not sure that I want a bridge that looks like the strings don't really fit.
So I'll have another look and see if I can't find something that's the correct size, otherwise I'll try drilling out the low B hole to 4 mm and see if that helps. Looking at the picture of my bass again, there's not a lot of scope to go for a wider spacing.
Drilling out the existing one may be the way to go but not a lot of fun as you will need to drill in reverse so that it doesn't bite and tear too much out or break the drill bit.
Fivers are wide enough and agree that you want things fairly compact if at all possible.
Hey Waz, for the Entwistle pups did you have to modify the standard kit routes?Quote:
Originally Posted by wazkelly
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Hi Ponch, yeah I had to reshape part of the scratch plate and chisel out a bit for the bridge PUP too. Here are the before and after shots and if you look close enough the mods become obvious in the 2nd shot....Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewdosborne
Attachment 16208Attachment 16209
The mounting lugs for both were a fraction wider than the stock units hence why they didn't drop straight in. Hope this helps answer your query.
Thanks Waz, yes answers my query. Pretty much the same procedure for the Tonerider jazz pups in my JBA. I was hoping for a solution with no pup route mods for my next JB build... I might pick up some jazz pup routing templates and have a crack at modifying that way
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Gotta wonder why the aftermarket ones are made that way? Copyright perhaps? Right proper PIA as it requires a fair amount of delicate work to make them fit.Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewdosborne
Edit: Should have mentioned that the Entwistle's covers can be popped off as they were the offending bit that wouldn't fit the standing routing.Quote:
Originally Posted by wazkelly
Now it looks like a proper Jazz Bass
Attachment 16817Attachment 16818
Apologies for the poor light as shot was taken indoors about an hour ago.
These 'Black' only block fret markers were bought on eBay and can be found via this link if anybody wants to get some. Plenty of Black Pearl out there but this was the only pure black I could find.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/151897358...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Looks great Waz. Was it easy to get the stickers straight and centred?
Looks really good Was I'm going to check out these block markers
Sent from Lineage OS 14.1
Hi Woks, it all depends on which way you point your tongue as you do it haha.Quote:
Originally Posted by wokkaboy
Did them freehand and could have been a bit more scientific and precise but reckon they are within 0.5mm to 1.0mm of where they should be.
Handy tip is to not peel all the backing paper off as once it touches a surface it wants to remain stuck at that point. Best to line it up where you want things positioned and then peel back a small bit on one of the short edges, then press that part down hard so that it is stuck firm and then gently pull the rest of the backing paper away from underneath. Same method we use when putting price stickers on car windscreens which are harder due to their larger size and also heat can cause them to trap air bubbles too.
With these block marker stickers they also come with very brief instructions but you still need to figure out where to start as there were more block markers than required so probably a few spares are included just in case there are any stuff ups.
I have a fairly intricate one on it's way from Japan for the current Tele build and this was an easy practice run ahead of that.
Thanks Ponch.Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewdosborne
nice one cheers Waz, if I build another bass (I mean when haha) and if the kit doesn't have block markers I will try these out. Looks like the last marker on 19th fret would have been just wide enough to cover the dot marker
I have a loathing of '70s Fenders so this all seems a retrograde step to me. But far be it for me to condemn what perversions you enjoy in the comfort of your own home. ;)
Hey Simon I saw on the news Bunnings have now opened in UK so waiting for a selfy haha - extra points if you are having a sausage in bread !
how far is this store from you ?
http://www.news.com.au/finance/busin...03b13f8db957e9
@ Waz sorry for the thread jack !
Spot on Woks.Quote:
Originally Posted by wokkaboy
St Albans is about 45 miles/73 km away from me, but a lot of the journey is round the outer-London circular car park called the M25, so you'd really have to be desperate for a sausage to go there unless you had to travel in that direction.
Hi Simon, I owned 2 of these white Ibanez models back in the early 1980's and fell in love with the look and feel of them, particularly the Jazz block markers on a maple fret board as that was quite rare at the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Barden
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And a sausage sandwich is well known to us Brits, less popular than a bacon sandwich or roll, but still a staple of Cafe breakfast menus.
The mentioned 'chip buttie' is a lovely once-in-a-while carbohydrate-rich treat, but way down in popularity compared to a sausage sandwich. It may sound weird, but the combination of decent chips in nice bread and oozing with melted butter is very satisfying.
Nice basses, Waz, but for me, they just look better with dot markers.
Nice work on the blocks Waz!Quote:
Originally Posted by wazkelly
Is the vinyl very thick? How well do you think they will hold up?
Hi Zandit, the vinyl is quite thin and should hold up ok however I am tempted to put a couple of coats of TO over them to make sure they remain permanent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandit75