Use white decal paper?Quote:
/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from SIMpleONe89 on August 14, 2013, 16:39
Hi guys how would I go about creating a decal for a black background ala Gibson headstock style? How exactly would you print a white font on decal paper?
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Use white decal paper?Quote:
/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from SIMpleONe89 on August 14, 2013, 16:39
Hi guys how would I go about creating a decal for a black background ala Gibson headstock style? How exactly would you print a white font on decal paper?
Dumb idea -
1. - white decal paper and do your logo as a negative (void) on a black background that would cover the whole headstock, then trim to the size of your headstock - that way you have a consistent layer / thickness
2. - get a signwriter to print it for you
3. - get a bigger than normal white truss rod cover & put it on that
4. - model paints & a steady hand
5. - talk with AJ re: his headstock...
6. - inlay.
Printing White Decals for Black Headstock ...
I'm playing around with this at the moment as I've put a black veneer cap on the head of my SG (under construction) and need a white decal myself ... its not as easy as it may seem, but not impossible
- Laser and Ink printers are fine for colours BUT they don't print white (oh well there's the easy option out of the way!)
- If you can find a commercial printer with an old ALPS printer (they can print opaque white) they'll be able to do it but have heard that those machines are real buggers to work with and most are getting rid of them these days (so if anyone does happen to find one, please let me know!)
- a good screen printer (and I mean a GOOD screen printer!) should be able to print you up your decals using the right ink and not make the resulting decal too "thick" (so it doesn't "feel" under the varnish) but this option will be pretty expensive as they'll have to create a screen especially for your print (not a cheap exercise unless your planning on producing hundreds of the buggers!)
- there's always inlay method if you've got plenty of patience and an even steadier hand
I've tracked down a printer here in Sydney that's giving it a go for me but I've yet to see any results - if it works out I'll certainly pass the details and info along to the community ... but if anyone comes up with any workable options or information, I'm all ears!
Hi Scott
see my 12 string build in non pitbull gear.
For a couple of bucks you can get a good white decal produced at www.best-decals.com.
http://www.best-decals.com/index.php...roducts_id=937
That's what I used anyway and I'm very happy with the results.
Hope this helps..
Cheers,
Gavin.
Looks like Gavin has the winner!
OH yes, Gav you've nailed it!!! ... Thanks for that, it'll sure save the rest of us a whole lot of screwing around!!!
Muchos gracias, amigo!
That's what I love about the PBG community - there's always someone out there who'll have the answer you need and gladly give it ... you just have to ask the right question! :D
I used Clear Laser label, reversed printed the out line, then gold leafed in between the lines, then sealed that with a light mist coat of clear lacquer, then added a few drops of pva glue to the water to soak the decal, then reverse laid the decal.. came up reasonably well. trick is to use thin black outline, and "paint the white color in side the outline.. use a white enamel paint , something like those little humbol paints would be suitable for what you need.
hope that helps.
There are a number of ways to tackle white (or light) coloured lettering on a dark headstock.
Most common would be to apply self-adhesive computer cut vinyl lettering....as Gavin did.
These are readily available from your local sign shop....support your local guy....you'll have more input into the design.
Apply it over top of your finished headstock....as long as no polish has been applied, then it won't stick.
The vinyl is very durable and sticks really well...be careful when cleaning though not to catch any corners of the letters with your cloth.
You can apply first and clear coat over it, but you do have to be careful, and because vinyl lettering is a lot thicker than waterslide decals, it would be difficult getting a dead smooth finish without "feeling" the lettering under the clear coats.
But as no one here uses a spray gun and the dreaded unmentionable :? ... apply your decal over your finish!!
Just wanted to share my recent water slide decal experience.
Ordered the lazerjet decal paper.
While waiting for this to arrive I put together my guitar logo for MIDNIGHT.
paper arrived looked it over read the info all very straight forward
Had to go see my printing lady for some work jobs so took over my paper and got her to print out for me..happy times
She had never seen this paper before so of she went read the instructions , all good.
TIM grabs a sheet out hands it over in and out of the printer , looks great.. more happy times
Now I am back at my desk neck layed out head all cleaned up ready for application . Bowl of water (cold water) first logo cut out in it goes............
Waiting waiting waiting . Nothing...mmmmmmm
Read the instructions again (soak decal in luke warm water ..ohh ok then..
New bowl of water cut out another logo (I had printed a whole page of logos) soak new logo in luke warm water...
Waitnig waiting waiting ..nothing...
Now I am getting a bit POed at this stage looking for an email on the packaging to abuse someone for sending me crap paper.
Third time the charm new logo new water held my tounge in a different direction.
Decal goes in and I wait............. Nothing
Start to have frequent outbursts #@$! £
Not a happy camper by this stage..
Come on Tim its not that hard you built plenty of car models as a kid you can do these decals with your eyes closed.
Grab the sheet start cutting out fourth logo
While cutting and mumbling happen to notice something diferent on one of the other sheets
Mmmmm
Drag out all the other sheets and lay them out with my now cut up logo sheet.
Strange my logo sheet is a different colour.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh penny drops
Some numb skull ie ME
Had handed over a piece of backing card for printing.
Needless to say was feeling some what stupid at this stage
The missus had a great old laugh as did my printing lady when I went back over to get the right piece printed..
Needless to say all things worked out on my first attempt with the right paper and it looks great
Very sad story Tim, I'm sure we (the PBG community) are all commiserating with you ... well, I'm sure we will be once we stop laughing and pick ourselves up off the floor! :D
Not trying to tub it in, but my recent decal experience (today in fact!) .. went like a dream.
Having done a black veneer-capped headstock for the SG (build diary - "SG's SG") I needed a white "name" ... and to leave it unnamed would just be criminal! So of course I started investigating getting white decals printed ... Not too much to ask one would think? I wouldn't have thought so either, after all the decal paper is so readily available ... until I tried to find someone who could print white! (see previous post on this thread) ... after making so many phone calls to find printer who could manage white (without having to go to the exhorbitant extent of screen printing) that I think I paid Telstra's entire annual holiday pay bill, I was just about to give up and go with cut vinyl lettering ...
... and then I discovered a Sydney company Nova Sublimation.
These guys sell a whole range of printing papers, inks, etc., etc. ... and just on a chance I gave them a ring to see if they could recommend someone and it turns out they do a whole variety of printing themselves! Had my prayers been answered? ... you bet they had!!!
I took them the artwork files I had created (so there was no artwork for them to do - saves good bucks) and in 15 minutes I had two A4 sheets of decals (of varying designs) of the crispest and sharpest solid white printing anyone could ask for, and the cost? ... $11 per sheet!!! ($10 +GST) ... considering that each A4 fits about 45 separate decals - I've got at least the next few years of PBG kits covered! (Adam - I hope you plan to keep your stocks up? - I've got a lot of decals to use! :D )
And the quality? ... I couldn't asked for better! (see pics following) ... actually I did put a couple of large versions on each sheet (for guitar case, etc.) so the Lap Top got "branded" as well (as a test run).
Short of it is ... if you want decals printed (especially in white) and you're in Sydney or on the east-coast (or anywhere really as these guys do on-line sales), I'd thoroughly recommend getting in touch with these guys - really good service, top price and nice blokes to deal with ... and they even do full-body multi-colour graphics as well (apparently a couple of Sydney-based luthiers use them already) if you can create an art file of it (Corel, Adobe, GIMP, etc.), they can print it!
Nova Sublimation Aust. (www.novasublimation.com.au & www.decalpaper.com.au) ... or give Toby Warne a call (02) 8332 3042 ... oh, and they don't print on the backing cardboard unless you ask them (Sorry Tim :D )
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...-Headstock.jpg
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...uew-Laptop.jpg
Logo looks great Scott, and am glad you found humour in my stupidity..
My printing lady was still laughing about it the other day when I went to get some plans printed.
:)
Thanks Tim ... I'm quite happy with them (especially as it worked out so well first time ... for once!)
I only laugh in sympathy ... because, unfortunately, I personally relate so much to that area of the "human condition" (i.e. dumb mistakes! ) ... but yes, laugh I did! :D
Logo looks great Scott.
I will give them a try on my next build.
Did they have the logo paper already? Do I just have to prepare an a4 printable file for them?
cheers,
Gavin.
Thanks for the laugh Mr Tim.... you Numpty :)
I bet Miss Linda is still laughing
Here's our new logo on a water slide decal on a new headstock for the marri strat, about time we got a logo on the headstocks !!
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...7-IMG_2417.jpg
wow wokka, that looks the biz
Cheers Stan, we wanted a simple logo and happy how it turned out, about an hour mucking around on paintshop and traced the outline on autocad to get a thicker line. Enjoying working with veneers on headstocks too !
looks great when applied there Woks!
Hi Gav,
Yes Nova Sub have the paper (and sell it online too) and are fully set-up as commercial printers too (i.e. Sublimiation Printing is their main business).
I knocked my design up on Corel Draw and gave them the .cdr file to print directly from (which maintained maximum detail and clarity rather than then exporting to another file format) but they did say that they can even print them from pdf (although having white text on white paper in pdf is really going to work is it! :D) and should be able to handle most file formats ... though best to speak with them if you're using an exotic graphics program.
If you've got it hand-drawn they can always scan it in and take it from their though you might have to pay a little extra for "artwork" charges ... still, depending on size you should be able to fit an average of 35-40 04 more decals on a single A4 sheet (and the printing charge was $10 for the sheet including the paper so it'll still be cheap "per decal" even with some "artwork" charges, unless you get them to do a whole of work)
Nice logo there Woks ... looks great on the blonde head!
Here's a tip for those Pitbull decal users. This product is called Micro Sol. Its a decal setting solution that is mainly used in the scale modelling scene. It allows the decal to conform to different shapes and basically makes the decal look painted on.
For the best results, I first apply Micro Sol to the prepared the surface. Make sure the surface is free of particles that could get under the decal's film and cause a blemish. Then, when everything is dry enough that the decal will not move easily, apply Micro Sol with a small flat brush. Apply with as few strokes as possible so a not to disturb the decal. Then allow the decal to dry without disturbing it. One application is enough in most cases, but if necessary, a second application of Micro Sol can be helpful.
You can pick this stuff up from decent hobby shops.
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content.../4039d-sol.jpg
Got some headstocks logo'd bit of an art to apllying the decals but practice is gold
http://pitbullguitars.com/wp-content...5-22.06.11.jpg
lookin' good wokks
Found a gibson font, but they want money so we can counterfiet our guitars . something oddly wrong about that lol
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/nicksfonts/gitfiddler-nf/
PK
Hey guys, just wondering if someone might be able to help me out here.
I'd originally planned on making a black waterslide decal of a logo I'd designed to go on the back of a bare timber headstock (just to be clear, when I say "bare timber" I mean natural, The headstock already had a light coat of lacquer)
So I bought some paper on ebay. They printed off beautifully, took the sealing lacquer no worries at all, seemed to stick to the headstock well, but as soon as I tried to cover it up with lacquer (nitro) it just started to lift. I tried this 3 times with the same problem each time.
So I've changed my whole plan of attack since then and have decided to go with a black painted stinger on the back of the headstock which means I now need white printing on a waterslide decal. Does anyone know of a solution for getting this done locally? I've come across a few blokes printing these in the States but they're dear as poison and I'm thinkin' there must be people able to print these sort of decals a bit closer to home. I'm totally open to any suggestions regarding getting this design on here bearing in mind I've already tried a vinyl decal on the front of the headstock which disintegrated under the nitro.
Cheers in advance.
http://i.imgur.com/lXrXhyV.jpg
Hey Bargeloobs, I've always put the waterslide decal on before any clear coats, then I apply the clear coats ontop to protect it. Can't you print the logo in white and apply it on the colour coat before any clear coats ?
I'd get in touch with forum member Andyport has a sign printing company, he can probably give you a solution. Email him at citysigns@internode.on.net
So you're saying you lay the logo on bare unfinished timber before shooting clear? I'm not saying it's not the way because obviously it works for you but everything I've read about covering waterslides with nitro is you need to lay a light layer of nitro on the surface before the decal goes down.Quote:
/<\\/p>[/<\\/p>[/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/]<\\/p>/]<\\/p>/Quote from wokkaboy on May 13, 2014, 11:03
Hey Bargeloobs, I've always put the waterslide decal on before any clear coats, then I apply the clear coats ontop to protect it. Can't you print the logo in white and apply it on the colour coat before any clear coats ?
I'd get in touch with forum member Andyport has a sign printing company, he can probably give you a solution. Email him at citysigns@internode.on.net
I tried sticking a waterslide straight to my bare headstock overlay, shot it with clear and it left the outline of the waterslide really visible and eventually started to lift.
Also average printers don't print in white hence the reason I need a professional.
I definitely give Andyport a try, thanks heaps Wokks!
Bargeloobs I know nothing about using nitro and decal stickers, so Andy should be able to help. I've been applying them after stain coats and using wudtone or tru oil clear over and been getting good results, although the clear part of the sticker is pretty obvious.
Last 6 or 8 headstocks I've used Andy has made some 4D Guitars vinyl stickers and they look excellent and there's no clear backing
http://www.pitbullguitars.com/wp-con...0-01.18.59.jpg
Andyport is the go-to guy in all things decal!
Give him a holler!
I'm catching you Gav, I'm only 48 posts behind mate !
Yep...done, cheers Gav, Wokks!Quote:
/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from Gavin1393 on May 13, 2014, 14:10
Andyport is the go-to guy in all things decal!
Give him a holler!
Hi Bargeloobs
Don't know if I will be of much help really.
My wide format sign printer doesn't print white.
The lettering in your logo is way too small to vinyl cut...the only way is to print it.
Not sure why you are having trouble spraying lacquer coats over the waterslide decals.
I did it on my JM-1 headstock, although I was used Acrylic Auto Lacquer not Nitro.
I just sprayed down a few base coats, let it dry for a few days, then wet sanded completely smooth.
Printed the black waterslide decal, used the same Acrylic Lacquer to seal it, applied to headstock.
Let it dry off, then built up the top coats by misting them on.
Once it is completely sealed, then you can lay the coats on heavier.
You can just see a slight outline of the waterslide paper, more of a slightly different tint to it.
It came up really nice, and it is there to stay...won't be going anywhere!
I do have a contact in the sign industry with a new printer that can do white, but whether the white is solid enough to go over black and totally block it out, I don't know. But I will have to get back to you on that.
Sorry I can't help more.
Cheers
Andy
Hey thanks for taking the time to drop some info Andy.
I couldn't really figure out why it wasn't sticking either, I'd recently done a resto on a Tele of mine and put a new decal on a Mighty Mite neck using pretty much the exact same process you've outlined (but with nitro) and it worked sweet as.
The only thing I can think of is the decal paper I bought is dud.
No worries man, I've got a dude in the States who does mostly modelling stuff making me up a decal for the front (as pictured), if it works out I'll just have to get him to do another one for the back.
I just wanted to see if I could get it done a bit closer to home to cut down on costs and handling times but never to mind.
At least waiting round for stuff to turn up from the States will give my finish a chance to cure.
Thanks heaps,
Nige.
http://i.imgur.com/P2yWqvL.jpg
sounds like the decal paper may be dodgy Nigel. Why don't you try and experiment applying the paper using a different finish ?
My only other thought on the lacquer issue was, were you allowing the nitro coats to dry of properly between coats?
If you lay on too many wet coats, there is a definite risk of it reacting with the decal and it will bubble.
Would love to be able to print white like that, but you're talking big dollars when it comes to printers for our industry. Sorry I couldn't help more...you would think there must be someone out there in this big wide land of ours that can do this, hey. Hope you get on alright with this guy in the States. BTW your design looks good.
All the best
Andy
Yeah good idea, I've got some poly laying round from my last build, I'll try that on an old neck and see what happens.Quote:
/<\\/p>[]<\\/p>/Quote from wokkaboy on May 13, 2014, 15:28
sounds like the decal paper may be dodgy Nigel. Why don't you try and experiment applying the paper using a different finish ?
thats what I try and do Nigel, narrow down the problem till you nail it !
Well I thought I was giving it sufficient time but who knows, I'll keep playin' round on some test pieces and see if I can figure it out.
Holy sh#t, I know what you're saying regarding the cost of printing gear, I was looking at a few different things just out of curiosity and yeah, that stuff ain't cheap.
Apparently this guy can go over the decal a few times to get the white (it is white, not green like in the pic) really vivid and bright so I've just gotta hope I can get it to stick.
Cheers.
Just on professional decals, I have a Fender Tele, a Japanese one, and if you hold the neck on the right angle you can see the outline of the decal. Everything is fully original; so even the pros are not super pedantic about their decals...
So is there any official word where we can get white decals printed?