Looking really good.
Printable View
Looking really good.
I really like that finish. Nice white binding too. Well done.
Yep, that's looking very nice indeed.
Sent from my Pixel 4 using Tapatalk
Looking good!
Referring to you post #33 above re: tuner buttons, just be aware that not all button shafts are created equal. By button shaft I mean the little shaft that the button fits over and is screwed to. (I'm sure there is a proper name for it but I don't know what)
I learnt this the hard way. I've found that aftermarket no-name ones can vary greatly and one set of buttons won't necessarily fit all shafts. Even name brands like Gotoh can vary within their own models. At least IME, I had one set of Gotoh tuners that wouldn't work with another set of Gotoh buttons.
Just warning you so you're not too disappointed when the Chinese buttons do arrive.
Not sure how painting them will go, but worth a try I guess.
As is normally the case, StewMac have a good video on how to replace that type of tuner button.
http://youtu.be/SB3RVVye-gw
Wow, it is looking great. Did you use a razor blade to scrape the binding?
That is looking great!
I think you may have to change your name from 'clueless' as the work you have done show some real skill!!
Just a note on the binding tape issue.
It is worth visiting a local model shop (you have several in Hamburg) and getting some lining tape. There are several makes but the most popular for modellers is made by Tamiya.
It comes in different widths (from about 2mm to 15mm) and is far more flexible than ordinary masking tape and will save you hours.
Looking forward to the next update.
Cheers
Ricky
Too much praise folks, it's not done yet and I still have plenty of opportunities to screw it up!
Yeah, I'm afraid you are right here ;-)Quote:
Originally Posted by McCreed
My tuners finally arrived in the mail and I realized the buttons are not screwed on, but most probably set with heat like in Simon's video from Stew Mac. That means the new buttons wouldn't fit on there anyway, but also, that I can't remove them for painting :(
The slightly good news is that they are not that horrible colored in real life than they are in the picture. The green is some greenish gray, I can probably live with it. They need some sanding/smoothing, though. Let's see how they look when they're on the guitar.
No, not a razor blade, but the blade of a crafting knife. Razors are too thin and too sharp for me, I think things would get downhill very fast with them. The small blade of the crafting knife (like a scalpel but no rounded edges) fit between my thumb and index nicely and I pinch it as a depth stop. I think they are called xacto-knives sometimes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor Davies
I do have the yellow Tamiya tape and it helped a great deal on my other builds :) However, I always have some underflow in curved areas, even if I use shorter lenghts to reduce tension. It just lifts itself after a little while. Or maybe it's not the right tape? It's the yellow tape from Tamiya in the gray plastic dispenser. But you are right, if I had taped it, I would have spent a few minutes to scrape a few areas with seepage, instead of the whole binding.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricky
While doing my taxes yesterday, I realized that I spent WAY TOO MUCH money for my guitar habit.... which actually ended in spending some more money to get a few sanding pads for this big boy. I carefully tried hand sanding in a few spots but I don't trust it. So I'm preparing to gather all the stuff I need for leveling it once it's cured. Feels a bit like a squirrel, collecting all these stuff that will become a guitar, eventually. (Hopefully! :D )
Rejoice! New poly arrived! Also the new sanding pads from Bosch, which are pretty awesome. Let the fun begin in the evening, it's too hot right now to anything productive except slamming together some websites.
This thing is not easy to sand flat. This is my second try and it still has some ridges. Now I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to sand through the poly, as I have no idea how to judge how thick the poly still is after all. So I'm probably adding a few more coats, to fill up ridges and such, then sand again.
Attachment 36982
Still on the strange quest to sand a curved thing flat :cool: :eek:
Attachment 36993
Attachment 36994
My shielded wire has arrived, that means I could actually make a template and start to soldering it up. I'm bit miffled because I bought 8 meters of wire and got 8 single packets with one meter each. D'uh.
I don't like the black pickup surrounds it came with. Any suggestions what would look better? Not sure about getting chrome ones, because if everything is chrome, nothing is chrome as well. Hm....
Cream to match the binding?
Gretsch do do guitars with white/cream pickup surrounds and black pickguards. It seems a reasonable option, especially as according to the photo its s B/W/B sandwich pickguard. A logo or decoration engraved into the black guard into the white middle layer might be really cool, but it would be beyond my skill to do.
Both good ideas! Noted, thanks! :-)
Currently starting to solder the harness while the guitar is drying, and I'm bored (husband is out with the guys). However, the kit came with 2x A and 2x B pots. I guess as there are 3 volume controls on the guitar, and only 1 tone pot, I would need 3x audio taper and 1x linear taper, right?
I think I have a few spare pots laying around, so hopefully they fit...
Currently, not progressing as happily as I wanted.
The shielded wire is really not nice to solder. It's pretty stiff and likes to break away from solder joins. The neck pickup is working fine, but no noise from the bridge pickup. The switch is working, tone and volume pots are working, solder joins are fine but pup is dead. Will try and solder another pup in, if this is working, I know the pup is bad, which would be a shame. If the replacement is also silent, I know the problem is somewhere else.
Also, I spent 3 hours yesterday sanding flat the guitar. It was all looking really nice and and I was on my last pass with grid 3000 wet, when I noticed brown traces on the paper - I sanded through the poly. On BOTH sides. It's becoming a tradition for me, I guess.
Luckily, no visible damage to the stain, also no idea WHERE I sanded through, but still..... I was THIS close to polishing it, fuuuuuu :(
Now, I'm spending a few more days wiping on more poly. Finishing really is the least fun part of the game.
You'll probably find that the first layer of poly took up some of the stain colour. so you've sanded down to that, but not through it. I do it all the time. I don't want to, but it happens.
Oh, that sounds plausible, thanks Simon! How do you judge how thick the poly is, or if there is enough left for polishing? I really struggle with this. On my last build (the single cut style with the blue top), I polished through the top coat and it took a while to recoat it. I didn't polish it as much as I'd like to afterwards because I was too scared to mess it up again. So it would be really annoying to polish through the poly on this build, too.
Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think you may be trying to get the top coat too perfect before moving to the polishing stage.Quote:
How do you judge how thick the poly is, or if there is enough left for polishing? I really struggle with this. On my last build (the single cut style with the blue top), I polished through the top coat and it took a while to recoat it. I didn't polish it as much as I'd like to afterwards because I was too scared to mess it up again.
If you try to remove every single orange peel dimple, rag stroke or imperfection, you will sand through before you reach Nirvana - that perfectly flat blemish-free coat. (unless the coating is incredibly thick, and that has problems of its own)
I have been guilty of this myself until I realised that there is an acceptable level of orange peel and imperfection that will still polish to the point of a mirror shine, and I will bet real money that 99% of anyone wouldn't even notice.
Even high-end automobiles will have some degree of orange peel in their finish.
I've come to realise that OP is broadly misrepresented and misunderstood. That it's not necessarily as bad as it is just a reality.
I reckon if you can get to 85-90% before final polishing, you'll still end up with good looking finish.
Learnt this the hard way. I also started looking closely at a lot of paint work, on everything from refrigerators to sports cars. If you look close enough, you'll find something.
Mh, you are probably right. But, being objective, and not from a perfectionist's eyes, there are quite a few dimples and dips in the top coat right now. How would I proceed here best? Is it the best to FILL these or sand the rest of it flat? I just don't really know.
I tried to polish it a little, but now it's a mixture of shiny and shitty. If there are tiny dust spots in the coat before polishing, they just become shiny dust spots, they are not polished away. Are you guys using some more aggressive way of polishing? Or what am I doing wrong?
I usually sand everything as flat an perfect as I can, then use Meguiar's cutting compound and then Meguiar's polish. I use a polishing pad that I mount on a drill.
Maybe your eyes are just younger than mine, and all that stuff is there and I can't see it any more... Are you using a sanding block of some kind at the 600 grit stage? I don't see dust spots after that stage. Unless, I suppose, wildly speculating, you have the wrong sort of dust... Ordimary house dust is going to be, well, lets not go into the ghastly details, but mainly stuff that's relatively soft and will sand away readily. I suppose it must theoretically be possibly to have airborne silt particles that would be silica and not be abraded so readily, but dammit, you're not on the edge of the steppes, I don't know why your dust should be worse than mine 750km to the west...Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatCluelessGerman
Hum..... err.... after polishing it 3 days ago, and not touching it any further, I just noticed these areas today.
It's hard to photograph, the guitar is glossy, but there are matte spots "underneath"? I don't know how to describe it best.
They weren't there when polishing it, but as the gloss is not broken, I don't think these are spots where I polished through? Or are they?
Attachment 37035
Attachment 37036
Alas, as I wasn't happy with the finish anyway, I think it's best to go back adding a few hundred coats of poly :rolleyes:
Not very motivated...
Oh, I have another question.... After trying the high gloss finish, I think I don't like it. I'd rather go for a nice semi gloss finish, shiny but not reflective. I don't have any satin varnish, so I'd hope to achieve it with sanding but not polishing. The question is how to do it best. I have some micro mesh sanding paper, would I just go up the grids, to, say, 8000? Or is there a better way? Probably polish it up to high gloss and then knock it down with micro mesh? I don't know.
I've seen this. I assumed I had polished through tru oil into the sealer filler underneath. After careful consideration I decided I couldn't spot the difference from a normal distance and left it. Also I only target moderate gloss not full mirror. But your finish is just poly isn't it? We could speculate that it's an area where the underlying finish isn't fully cured, and so isn't taking a full polish yet, but it would just be speculation.
Yes, just stain and poly, no sanding sealer or pore filler. After adding a fresh coat of poly, it looks like it's gone, but can't say for sure until it's dry.
My own way of achieving moderate gloss was to stop polishing when I was happy... It depends how moderate, but going to 1200 paper then a moderate amount of hand polishing with t cut (auto abrasive polish) pleased me.
That kinda looks like the 'blushing' that occurs when spraying nitro in high humidity. I.E. The affected area sits within the finish. I'm unaware if the same thing happens with polyurethane (in whatever application method).......but it's very odd that it wasn't there during polishing. If you look across the surface at a very low angle, can you see any step down into those spots? That might give you a better idea of whether it is sanding related.
I can only add to JimC's speculation. It does appear to be under the surface and all I can think of is possible contamination like skin oil or a solvent of some kind. BigDaddy makes a good observation by comparing it to blushing as well.
I have not encountered this problem with polyurethane either and don't have any solid diagnoses or fix.
However I will raise a point about trying to achieve the satin finish as you mentioned.
I don't want to sound negative or tell you you shouldn't do it, but turning a gloss finish into a satin finish is never going to look like a satin finish. It will always look like a glossy finish that was de-glossed.
This is because a genuine satin clear coat has a small proportion of solids mixed into it that actually diffuse the light and give it that non-shiny appearance. Very much the same way that a satin finish can be polished to a gloss, but it will lack the depth a real gloss finish material (poly, nitro etc) has. It's merely shiny "on top".
As for feel and touch (for instance on a neck) yes, de-glossing will feel similar to satin, but again side-by-side comparison there will be a visual difference.
It's almost as if one layer of poly has delaminated from the one below it, but that's only a guess. Or it may be taht the bottom layer of poly is coming away from the wood itself.
After swearing a lot, I'd probably go and rub those areas back until I thought I'd reached that layer and maybe just polish from there, or maybe then add some more poly and then polish.
Hey guys,
thanks so much for all your advice and opinions!
Whatever it is, it was not lower than the surrounding areas. Also, the gloss went over it and was not broken, so I don't think it's been sanded through.
Interesting comment about the blushing, I remember it was VERY hot and humid during the days I made the last coats of poly, but I am very sure I didn't see these areas before and after polishing (at least on the day I did it). I polished it and inspected it from all angles to judge if I like the outcome (I didn't). Then I decided to set it aside for a few days as I had some work to do.
I just noticed these areas when picking it up from the wall hanger today.
Also pretty good idea with the skin oils, but I'm pretty sure that's not it, as I'm usually wearing gloves when working on the guitar, even when sanding, because I don't want to have skin contact with the sanding dust (but I never wear respirators, talk about being stupid...).
So what I did today is to rough up the gloss surface and apply another coat of poly. Currently, it looks good, but I can only say for sure if it's dry.
I remember seeing a weird thing on my last build, too - don't know if it's the same - where I would see the different coats of poly after the final sanding. Like if you cut a tree and see the rings. But to a much smaller extend, so I can't say if it's the same. I "fixed" it by covering it with a few more layers of poly and then just lightly removing the dust before polishing.
I think this is going to be my last guitar build for a little while (unless we get locked up again...). I think I'll build an amp next :D
Yesterday, I was THIS CLOSE (<->) to throwing this thing out of the window.
After rebuilding the poly and sanding it flat again, I just couldn't polish it again. Whatever I did, it just didn't want to get a nice even surface... It got shiny in some places and stayed matte/milky in some others. I promised it I'd smash it on the wall if it's not playing along.
Today, I found some really old abrasive paste in the tool drawer (I think I bought it in 2013 when my first car got a scratch...) and gave it a go, couldn't get worse, right?
To my surprise, it worked pretty well - compared to how it looked before. Now, the surface is very shiny with scratches. Yep. Nice. But better then before so I'm really not complaining (well, just a little). I had actually hoped for a satin finish, but I don't know how to get there, and I'm too afraid to mess up the poly again.
I think my finishing skills are so bad, I don't even know where to start improving. No matter if I use tru oil, poly or whatever, I just can't seem to get it right.
Attachment 37075
It was time to remove the tape from the neck. Look how different the poly looks on the binding. Not too sure what to do with the neck binding now. Probably nothing and wait until it gets dirty from playing?
Attachment 37076
Looks ok from 2 feet away.
Attachment 37077
Shiny, with scratches! I'm trying to pass it a s a feature.
Attachment 37078
Pretty desperate try to put something on the headstock. Unfortunately, light paint on a decal looks bad (I tried!), so I went with a shape that I can cut by hand. This MOP sticker sheet is really a b*tch to cut. I think I spent 2 hours cutting this and it's still looking pretty rough. But oh well, now it's on and maybe it will look ok from 2 feet away, too =)
I'd leave the binding as it is. Even on major brand guitars, you often find the neck and body bindings are slightly different colours.
You can just keep polishing away until the scratches finally go. Just have a go once a day and you'll get there. I've found that brass polish (I use a UK a brand called Brasso), seems to be very good at getting rid of scratches, better than the car polishes like T-cut or Meguire's Scratch X2.0 (at least on nitro). Edit: Only add Brasso to a cloth and apply from the cloth, don't pour it on to the guitar itself. It contains a small amount of ammonia and a pool of it if left, can eat into nitro and acrylic finishes (and maybe others).
I find the long nails on my playing hand keep adding scratches to my finishes, so I have to cut them back when I'm in polishing mode.
The MOP looks fine to me. Putting the tuners on will smarten up the look of the headstock as well.
You are doing fine. Don't despair.
There's no point in getting too wound up about not possessing in full measure skills that traditionally took years to acquire:-)
I use some stuff called T-cut as a polish, which is marketed as a "colour restorer", but basically its an abrasive polish. It 'restores' colour by polishing off the old oxidised paint and exposing what's underneath. Those who use it too often on their vehicle do indeed find out what's underneath!
To share your pain, I've spent the last week attempting to cut a nut for my mandolin project.
I gave up on the first one in disgust. I was using the wrong material.
Work on the second has involved a lot of refilling too deep cuts with filing powder and superglue, and a very great amount of deciding that something else is more important and really needs doing first. Upgrading the case of my 100 year old family heirloom mandolin with better padding, for instance, isn't progressing too badly.
There's going to have to be a third, and I hope by then I'll have managed to get something acceptable.
The moral of the story is, we all suffer setbacks regardless of our level of experience.
Some builds go smoother than others, but I've not one that has been either trouble-free or flawless.
Guys, you are right. It's a craft that takes years to master - I tend to forget that and then get frustrated when it's not working out as I imagined.. Sounds very millennial-ish :eek:
It also has a lot to do with the "inner vision" I guess. I had this vague image in my head of what I wanted to do when I ordered it, but then, between the order and the start of the build, I already had 3 other guitars finished (and, for the record, I think they all turned out somewhat cool, at least in my opinion). So a lot of my initial ideas got somewhat blurred and faded away. Also, when it comes to the details.... I know I want a brass pickguard and trussrod cover, and I want to etch it. But what am I going to etch on it? I also knew I wanted the MOP headstock decoration, but WHAT do I want to have? In the end, I settled on something I copied from an existing headstock, but it's a bit random and meaningless. I still haven't got any idea about the "theme" of the guitar, so I think this contributes much to the feeling of frustration with the build.
Also, the fear of polishing through the poly (again), so I'm not sure what to do about the scratches - try to polish it again, and maybe polish through the poly, or leave them and have my eye catch them every time I look at it?
Sometimes, I think I should have just painted it, but then, on the other hand, I don't see any sense in copying a guitar design that can be bought as is at the music store. If I wanted to have the "standard" orange rockabilly Gretsch guitar, I could just purchase a perfectly fine factory made model. But it's going to be just like any other orange Gretsch guitar. So I should just embrace my not perfect but not standard guitar, even if it's not what I first had in mind.
Remember that the scratches are in the poly, not the wood. So if you can see a scratch, you still have poly. Sanding at anything but a very fine grit is aggressive and you can run the risk of over-sanding. And sanding can hide whether you've removed the scratch or not, so mentally you often keep on sanding beyond the point you should as you don't want to stop sanding, polish and still see a scratch.
You can always try using a paintbrush to run more poly along the line of the scratch to fill it, as it is a single main scratch, (at least in that position), and then sand that flat.
You are right about everything. Is there a way to know if you have sanded enough and the scratches are gone? Because that's what's happening to me all the time. Sanding, thinking now all the scratches are gone and it's perfectly even and flat, then polish, and tada: shiny with scratches....
No. I sand through all the time! I have the ability to spray and so I spray more coats than I really should but even then I still sand through on and around edges. It just doesn't take as long when spraying to put on enough coats again to have another go at messing it up.
Note that I still haven't finished my original 2016 kit purchase, and you've finished three this year!
We’re all suckers for punishment around here and often a little OCD. It must be part of the nature of the people attracted to this pass time. So it’s flawed, but beautifully so. Take a step back and appreciated the good work you’ve done on your unique guitar. All of my kit guitars are flawed either from the factory or my own efforts but as time goes by I wouldn’t have them any other way. Fix your issues if you can, otherwise don’t be too hard on yourself.
Besides which, Sod's law says that even if you did manage to create the perfect finish the moment you take it outside to get a photo to show your friends, a bird will poo on it.
I'd take the tiny scratches...
They'll appear the first time you use it anyhow. :)
OK, I'll try to relax a little :D
I ordered some new polishing pads (how often can you use these? Do you wash them with detergents?) and some metal polishing compound for the pickguard and the trussrod cover (which I still need to make btw.).
Just found out that my husband got me an amp for my birthday, yess :D
Too bad the guitar won't be ready in time, but it's not that it's the only one I have, so... :D
Need to act surprised tomorrow ;)
The heat wave in Germany has ended abruptly and it's amazing how LONG the poly needs to dry now that it's colder. It even got some milky surface from trapped moisture but I gently sanded the top and this helps with evaporation.
Attachment 37108
I guess after it's dry, it will take at least a week to properly harden enough to flat it down. I should have done the headstock way earlier...
Will try to polish the finish a little more (carefully!) and then try to install the electronics. Even though my wiring works NOW on the template, I'm afraid the stiff cables will ripp off the soldering points somewhere, so I'm currently contemplating if I'm going to rewire it NOW with modern, flexible cables, or risk it and rewire it later after much cursing.