PDA

View Full Version : Factory Visit



adam
28-08-2016, 08:32 AM
Hey all,

Next week I'm heading to China and I will be visiting the Factory where our kits (and Guitars) are manufactured.

I'm hoping to have a meeting with the Factory manager and raise a few issues that regularly pop up with our kits.

I'm going to ask them about:



Misaligned tuner and string through body holes.
The thickness of the veneers; ie, can we pay more for a thicker veneer?
Glue spots
Wonky headstock shaping on some of the 3 a side headstocks.
Turnaround on custom orders, which seems to vary between 4 and 12 weeks. Hoping to come up with some guidelines so we can give a more accurate ETD for custom orders.


If you have any recurring issues to add, please post in this thread.

The neck twist issue has been resolved. That is, they are aware of it and are going to replace the necks of the 23 kits we have collected here with twisted necks.

If it's just "Can they make XYZ?", please email this to me and I can email my contact.

Andy40
28-08-2016, 09:49 AM
Hi Adam,

The jack hole in the SGD-612 probably needs to be moved from the factory settings.

13453

As you can see from the position, the jack, when inserted, shorts out on the back of the pot.

I plugged my hole, and drilled another one on the top of the body. Its heaps better there.

1345613457

(thank god you guys know i'm talking about guitars......:o)

wokkaboy
28-08-2016, 10:45 AM
Hey Ads, sounds good, hope there are no language barriers between yourself and the factory manager.
The tele kits the bridge pup cavity should be moved about 5mm toward the neck. Also the tele neck pup cavities are too big. We had a discussion a while ago and most forumites wanted a single neck pup route. Currently the neck pup route is too big for a standard humbucker surround.
Good luck with the visit !

DrNomis_44
28-08-2016, 04:03 PM
That's cool, so when does Adam get back from visiting the factory in China?, I need to email him about that 51 Tele kit that I want to order soon.


@ Adam Wishing you a happy and safe flight to China and hope all those issues with the kits can be all sorted out, cheers mate.

Dedman
28-08-2016, 04:26 PM
Pot holes on the FB-1M are too close to the raised section to get knobs on I believe.

wazkelly
28-08-2016, 08:33 PM
Neck PUP Rout on J Bass is too large in case anybody wanted to go sans pick guard.

adam
29-08-2016, 03:59 PM
I'm still here DrNomis, leave early Friday morning, hopefully. I only thought on Saturday, "hmmm, I wonder if I need a Visa?". Of course I do. The good people at the Perth Chinese Visa Office kindly sympathised with me being a complete fricken idiot and have arranged the Visa for pick up Thursday (day before I leave).

Keep the comments coming, it's good stuff I didn't know about.

Wokka, I thought we had decided on a clean, single coil size rout in the TL bridge. Not that they got that right, as they've gone the humbucker size again. I think the single coil size would be best then you can rout (file?) out if you want something bigger in there.

wokkaboy
29-08-2016, 04:13 PM
Hey Ads, yes if the builder wants a humbucker neck pup the single cavity can easily be routed to a humbucker size. Sounds good.
Glad you got your Visa sorted in time !

Andy40
29-08-2016, 05:07 PM
If I had to be really picky......the kick ramp (ie where the headstock meets the fret board) on the ST and TL kits is on a bit of an angle to the nut slot, here is a photo of my ST kit and the community ST



1350313504

Dedman
29-08-2016, 07:12 PM
Have number one golden good time Mr Adam.
Oh I suppose you know about "happy money?" the money you need to leave the foreman or manager to ensure every one is happy? A friend in the clothing industry is always complaining about happy money. His trick was he sent a woman to the factory saying she was a quality control inspector for his company, they paid HER happy money to say all was good ;D

DrNomis_44
30-08-2016, 12:25 AM
I'm still here DrNomis, leave early Friday morning, hopefully. I only thought on Saturday, "hmmm, I wonder if I need a Visa?". Of course I do. The good people at the Perth Chinese Visa Office kindly sympathised with me being a complete fricken idiot and have arranged the Visa for pick up Thursday (day before I leave).

Keep the comments coming, it's good stuff I didn't know about.

Wokka, I thought we had decided on a clean, single coil size rout in the TL bridge. Not that they got that right, as they've gone the humbucker size again. I think the single coil size would be best then you can rout (file?) out if you want something bigger in there.


Ah rightio, I'll wait till you get back from visiting the Factory, I have some guitar projects to work on in the meantime anyway, as Dedman said, hope you have a great time mate.

Brendan
30-08-2016, 07:23 PM
How about veneer sheets for headstocks? Some of the Flame / Quilted Maple would be nice! If it was available separately so you could add as part of the build process.... Anyone else like that idea?

wazkelly
30-08-2016, 07:29 PM
Great idea Brendan.

Andy40
31-08-2016, 05:29 PM
How about veneer sheets for headstocks? Some of the Flame / Quilted Maple would be nice! If it was available separately so you could add as part of the build process.... Anyone else like that idea?

Definatley

WeirdBits
31-08-2016, 05:49 PM
Enjoy the trip...

But, you know we'll expect a full video documentary showing the PBG kits being made when you get back, no pressure ;)

wokkaboy
31-08-2016, 07:08 PM
great idea Bman and Weirdy. They may not want video camera's in the factory in case we see some method or technique they may not want us to see but worth a go !

keloooe
01-09-2016, 02:19 PM
Would definitely be cool to see the techniques behind it if its allowed!

Dedman
01-09-2016, 02:51 PM
There is a video of a tour of the factory that makes Chapman guitars (and quite a lot of other brands) in Korea, I imagine the Chinese factory would be similar but without the dust masks and safety boots :P IE huge multi head cnc routers cutting 6 or more bodies at a time.

adam
01-09-2016, 07:27 PM
Thanks for all your feedback guys, appreciated. I will raise all of these issues.

I'm sure I will be able to get some video... I've seen some still shots from the factory and it doesn't look that exciting, but I'll try and get some stills/video of the various steps... and maybe even some shots of the actual Luthiers (I use that term loosely) who make our kits and guitars.

I'll check this thread again next Tuesday night, before the Factory visit on Wednesday.

wokkaboy
01-09-2016, 07:43 PM
all the best for the trip Ads, what's happening with GOTM judging do you want us to send comments/scores to Brendan or wait for your return?

Brendan
01-09-2016, 09:17 PM
Hey Wokks - I'll coordinate GOTM while Ads is away - there are some cracking entries, so it could be a tricky one!

Brendan
01-09-2016, 09:28 PM
Adam - MMB-4 - is the pickup 4 wire (red, green, black, white, earth) (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-1pcs-MM-Style-Bass-Guitar-Pickup-MusicMan-4-String-Bass-Pickup-/172195515332?hash=item2817a70bc4:g:x10AAOSw5HJXLBI C) or 2 wire (black /white) (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Musiclily-4-String-Bass-Pickup-For-Music-Man-Style-Bass-Parts-Replacement-New-/142046699420?hash=item2112a49f9c:g:6ngAAOSwKfVXJ9N m).

The 4 wire version is splittable and the 2 wire one is not. Given the control plate is has 3 knobs, I think we need the 4 wire, but there were a few 2 wire ones come through.

pablopepper
02-09-2016, 06:13 AM
I'll check this thread again next Tuesday night, before the Factory visit on Wednesday.

Don't count on it Ads. When I was in China two years ago I could not access this website (or many, many others) due to their super strict internet censorship. Don't count on facebook either, it just won't work.

stan
02-09-2016, 06:31 AM
I would be very surprised if they let you film there, or if the resulting film is something you might want to put up given the potential of their working conditions

pablopepper
02-09-2016, 07:25 AM
That depends, Stan. Where I was, in Shenzhen, the factories are mostly quite modern and they are very proud of them. We were invited to inspect almost all of the production facilities we contacted (CNC router and Laser cutter manufacturing).

Zandit75
02-09-2016, 07:59 AM
I would be very surprised if they let you film there, or if the resulting film is something you might want to put up given the potential of their working conditions

I visited the Chinese factory for our Hydraulic Rockbreakers back in 2008. They had no issues with us taking photos back then, but video wasn't as popular as it is now. While the factory looked as you would expect for an industrial workplace, the workers were slightly overdressed for what you would expect. When you see a woman working on a lathe in high heels, you know they asked everyone to dress up for our visit!!!
The biggest culture shock was seeing the toilet facilities. While they had plumbing, having to squat over a toilet bowl flush with the floor is not the best idea they have come up with! Thankfully a #1 was all that was needed by me while I was there, but my wife and bosses wife weren't overly impressed!!

Dedman
02-09-2016, 08:04 AM
LOL, squat toilets are pretty common in Japan too, not great for those of us with arthritic knees :P

dingobass
10-09-2016, 10:46 AM
Hey all.

Just had an email from our fearless leader.
Internet connection is a tad sketchy so Adam has asked me to let you all know that the factory tour was a resounding success and there will be photos and videos. (Appropriate bribes having been paid to the factory manager)

Dedman
10-09-2016, 11:00 AM
Hurray for happy money!

stan
10-09-2016, 12:06 PM
cool, but we are now known as Lucky Golden Dragon Guitars...

wokkaboy
10-09-2016, 02:33 PM
good stuff cheers for the update DB, look forward to Ads full pitch report on his return

adam
13-09-2016, 08:46 PM
Howdy all, I made it home, almost intact.

That little "niggle" in my ankle, before I left, turned out to be a full blown case of gout.

"Have you been drinking beer, walking a lot and having irregular sleep?"

Yes. Yes. Yes.

13851

Fricken painful, but I didn't let it stop me.


Updates from the factory visit to follow in the next few days.

Brendan
13-09-2016, 09:03 PM
Sorry to hear about the gout - good to hear that it didn't stop you.

wokkaboy
13-09-2016, 09:33 PM
Welcome home Ads. Hope you get over the gout your feet look well swollen

adam
13-09-2016, 10:13 PM
13852

Here's a great shot of all the key players in the production of our kits.

On the far left (of the photo) is Mr Chien, Production Manager for the factory. We got on really well and he listened to all the issues I brought up. We had a tea ceremony when I arrived, had a full tour of the factory and then went out to a fantastic lunch, where much alcohol was consumed (hence the gout).

The guy on my left is Tom who was the driver for the whole of my visit.

The woman in red is Amanda, our primary contact. We've been communicating for 4 years and have become good friends; I'd like to think genuinely. She is a real sweetie and just as I had imagined.

On Amanda's left is Jenny, who is Amanda's boss. She is always introduced as "the wife of the Manager", but she is also a Manager. This only makes sense in China.

And the woman on the end was clearly not important (/s) because no one ever introduced us... I assume it's Mr Chien's wife.

These two guys are their "Guard Dogs".

13853

Nope, not joking. Seems they spend their days in these cages and are let out at night to guard the factory. I assume the smaller one on the right guards with his adorableness and reminds the potential robber of all that is good with the world, so the robber immediately gives up, goes home, and takes stock of his life.

And, you know I'm a dog guy, but after the whole 10 days in China, everything I experienced, the one thought that is with me now is that the dog on the left didn't have any water in his bowl and it was stinkin' hot. And I didn't say anything.

Photos and vids of the inside of the factory to follow.

wokkaboy
13-09-2016, 10:32 PM
Nice intro to the key staff Ads.
Look forward to videos and more pics

DrNomis_44
13-09-2016, 11:50 PM
@ Adam Thank goodness you got back home to Oz safely, sorry to hear about the gout, hope you get well soon mate.

Andy40
14-09-2016, 03:21 AM
Dayum, sorry to hear about the foot, I bet its fricken painful.

Great update, thanks for that.

stan
14-09-2016, 08:53 AM
Welcome back, glad it was a successful trip, and gout sucks, get well

Dedman
14-09-2016, 10:09 AM
oooh gout sucks badly! Glad you could still soldier on and enjoy the visit.

keloooe
14-09-2016, 01:57 PM
Sucks to hear of the gout Adam, but great to hear you pulled through the trip!

adam
15-09-2016, 06:51 PM
Some more photos of the Factory...

These are all ours. You can see some MK-2 bodies bottom right.
13891

A shot of the factory floor. The women are doing some detail work. The factory was clean and very professionally set up. Not as I had pictured to be honest.
13892

Installing triple binding on one of our FV-1G headstocks.
13893

cont...

adam
15-09-2016, 06:54 PM
Mmmmmm, Mahogany
13894

And don't forget the Basswood and Ash
13895

And here's a bunch of our bodies ready for packing for our October/November order.
13896

Brendan
15-09-2016, 06:56 PM
That looks like a cracker of a trip Ads... Great shots of the factory...

Dedman
15-09-2016, 07:03 PM
Great pics Adam. I think we are conditioned by TV to think that Chinese factories have dirt floors and one 25watt bulb to light the whole place. Although there ARE places like that they are few and far between these days.

adam
15-09-2016, 07:17 PM
Here's a better shot of the factory complex.

I only got to see the first building, where they make the electric guitars and brass instruments.

They also make acoustic guitars, keyboards, electronics and other accessories. I'm not sure if they are made in the other buildings behind it, or elsewhere.

One takeaway from the trip was that I have a better understanding of the set up there. The factory is literally in a farming town. The workers also have farms or work on farms. This explains why we have delays when it is planting or harvest times.

13898

Of course, there was the obligatory long lunch involved and the food was fantastic. I was already a huge fan of genuine Chinese food and I was not disappointed once in the whole 10 days in China. I did make the mistake of not reading up on Chinese meal customs and made a few embarrassing mistakes, but it was very enjoyable. Note the three drinking vessels (not counting the tea).

13899

I don't what this was, but I did get feeling back in my face after 3 hours. It tasted a little like Japanese Sake, but much more alcoholic.

13900

The host seemed disappointed that I couldn't "Gambeh" (skol the whole glass) every time they yelled it. "I just had a kidney transplant and my nephrologist would not be happy with me drinking that excessively" does not translate easily. Amanda did her best.

wokkaboy
15-09-2016, 07:24 PM
some great pics you posted Ads, I agree I didn't think the factory would be that modern and clean. Some nice stash of timber and bodies ready to ship.
Hopefully the future tele's will have a single neck pup route and the bridge pup cavity moved north 5mm

dave.king1
15-09-2016, 07:26 PM
Nice pics and summary of the visit, I must confess I'm surprised by the number of ST bodies compared to the rest though.

adam
15-09-2016, 07:34 PM
Our Factory is a 3 hour drive North of Jinan, in the Shandong Province. I was thinking, "great, we might drive out of the smog", but we seemed to drive into the source of the smog.

On the way back it was a 5 hour drive 'cause a Truck crashed into one of the overpasses (I would bet my life he was on his phone while driving... everyone in China operates their phone while driving)
13901

You know it's bad when people get out of their cars and have a picnic from the back of their car. The guys over on the right started gambling on the road.

13905

DrNomis_44
15-09-2016, 11:54 PM
@ Adam Looks like you had a great time over in China visiting the Factory mate.

stan
16-09-2016, 04:54 AM
wow, some great insights there - and if that is the factory then I'd like to see the stash at PBG Central!

wokkaboy
16-09-2016, 07:14 AM
Only in China would people have a picnic and gamble waiting for a traffic jam to clear. Must be a common occurrence if they are that prepared for it. I'd just make sure I had a full esky of beer is good preparation haha

pablopepper
16-09-2016, 08:15 AM
Oh man, the smog is what I had the most trouble dealing with. Not being able to see the sky, even on a 'clear' day, is slightly terrifying.

Andy40
16-09-2016, 08:16 AM
Wow thats some cool shots of the factory, great work. Thanks heaps for posting this Adam.
I especially liked the sun going down over the traffic jam

FrankenWashie
16-09-2016, 09:26 AM
And here's a bunch of our bodies ready for packing for our October/November order.
13896

Is that a solid mahogany unbound LP I see in the bottom corner?

wokkaboy
16-09-2016, 09:35 AM
Frankie that would be a JR-1M mahogany LP junior, they don't have binding so that's ready to ship to PBG HQ

FrankenWashie
16-09-2016, 09:56 AM
Of course it is, I see the bolt on pocket on closer inspection. DUR!

wokkaboy
16-09-2016, 10:01 AM
no drama Frankie, biggest giveaway is the 1 x P90 pup cavity

FrankenWashie
16-09-2016, 10:28 AM
I mentioned it mainly because I am waiting on one for #5. Hopefully it should be in that lot for the October shipment.

wokkaboy
16-09-2016, 10:31 AM
which model LP did you order Frankie, a LP-1M hog kit ? They are cool kits

FrankenWashie
16-09-2016, 10:58 AM
Yeah that's him Wokka, No binding, inlay, hardware or veneers. Just a solid Hog body with HB routs and set for TOM and tailstop.

I'm plotting something Dark and Angry with it, but that's for later. I'm stupidly busy at the moment but if I'm lucky I might actually finish a build this year!

adam
16-09-2016, 04:56 PM
wow, some great insights there - and if that is the factory then I'd like to see the stash at PBG Central!

We had to rent our 4th Storage unit Stan. I recently got insurance (yes, I know, I should have had it ages ago) and the stock holding value is over 1/2 a mil. That's a lot of kits and upgrades.

But that's why we are succeeding, where others are dropping off; we have what people want in stock*, ready to ship.

*Most of the time, except when someone on here builds a stunning kit that has never sold and now EVERYBODY wants that one! So, please stop doing that ;-)

Andy40
16-09-2016, 06:07 PM
except when someone on here builds a stunning kit that has never sold and now EVERYBODY wants that one! So, please stop doing that ;-)

13914

(10 char)