Fender and Gibson, the cost is it worth it...Discuss amongst the group.

[stan]

overpriced for what you get, however will hold their monetary value better than most

[Fretworn]

15 years ago the trend was to trade in Custom shop or USA Fenders for Mexicans and then up grade to Switchcraft jack and pots. Generally believed that you ended up with an equally good guitar for half the price.

My only experience with recent Gibsons is that they don't stay in tune. Maybe the $4000 one are better, but the average Joe $2000 ones seem to need re-tuning after every song.

The whole reason for all the trademark lawsuits that Fender and Gibson took out against the Japanese makers in the '70s and '80s was that the Japanese factories were making better "Strats" and "Les Pauls" than they could, at a third the price. That's why Profile STs and TLs were so popular in Australia in the early '80s

[Dedman]

I'm just reading a book on Japanese guitars, seems there were very few to no actual law suits, just lots of threatening and chest beating. Basically many of the Japanese companies were so small and used sub-contractors working from home and tiny workshops that a successful lawsuit would would have netted nothing in damages. The Japanese just changed their designs the required percentage and most continued on or moved onto more profitable things. Much like trying sue a Chinese company or even worse a Pakistani company these days.

[keloooe]

Personally I'd go for a modded kit or a modded Squier if you want a decent F type instrument, Squier have seriously picked up the game over the last few years!

[HoneyBadgerJM]

It makes my happy to see the informed views on this topic I started, also no Bullies Saying cr@p to each other very dignified discussion.. On Gibson the number of Ghost Builders of Les Paul will never be known...The Guitar Slash played on Appetite and his main recording guitar is a Chris Dehring ghost build. The modern day Les Paul is the same as the CBS era Fenders 1972 post...Not going to be remembered as a great era.

[Tweaky]

If you saw the quality of the Gibson guitars hitting Australian shores back in the late 70's @ early 80's, you would know why they got a bad name, the inlay and fretwork particularly.

Not on all models mind you, it varied year to year, which come to think of it, would of been when Gibson's new owners wanted to move from Kalamazoo [ which had Union labor] to Tennessee, and open a new factory that didn't have union labor.

Subsequently Gibson lost 85% of it's old QA staff, when that big a change happens, things are bound to hit the fan.

The only time they would get a run of a particular model right, if it was the first one, all others varied from the original spec'd...Why this happened.... well self evident really.
You have accountants running a Instrument making company, it's bottom line is the end result that matters in their eyes.... Staff moral, which in turn effects staff pride in what they are building, just creates a ever downward spiral of lesser quality instruments.

The brand suffers as a consequence, the people that caused the demise don't see it as their fault, they recommend further cuts to retain profit margin, consequence is things slip even further into a ever downward spiral.....that's what happened when the corporate raiders ran things into the ground during the 90's

Put the #####$#'s up against the wall, and while your at it, I've got a few names of some Bankers that need to be lined up as well.
I will happily cast the first stone.

[Dedman]

I hear you Tweaky, same thing happened in many industry's. I have a few stones and a packet of gravel, save me a spot.

[Andy40]

If you saw the quality of the Gibson guitars hitting Australian shores back in the late 70's @ early 80's, you would know why they got a bad name, the inlay and fretwork particularly.

Not on all models mind you, it varied year to year, which come to think of it, would of been when Gibson's new owners wanted to move from Kalamazoo [ which had Union labor] to Tennessee, and open a new factory that didn't have union labor.

Subsequently Gibson lost 85% of it's old QA staff, when that big a change happens, things are bound to hit the fan.

The only time they would get a run of a particular model right, if it was the first one, all others varied from the original spec'd...Why this happened.... well self evident really.
You have accountants running a Instrument making company, it's bottom line is the end result that matters in their eyes.... Staff moral, which in turn effects staff pride in what they are building, just creates a ever downward spiral of lesser quality instruments.

The brand suffers as a consequence, the people that caused the demise don't see it as their fault, they recommend further cuts to retain profit margin, consequence is things slip even further into a ever downward spiral.....that's what happened when the corporate raiders ran things into the ground during the 90's

Put the #####$#'s up against the wall, and while your at it, I've got a few names of some Bankers that need to be lined up as well.
I will happily cast the first stone.

Geez Tweaky...where have you been lately haven't seen you in a while.

Good info mate.

[Tweaky]

I've having to be testing a video game, that is running well behind release schedule.

Any old Wipeout Anti grav racing fans ?

I'm working with R8 games, pretty much former Studio Liverpool who made the Wipeout games.

http://www.r8games.com/
https://www.facebook.com/R8Games/

I need test pilots that have Steam Access., and a relatively decent PC to game on ...PM Me, if have so.
I'll give you a STEAM test code, only two left.... it will only work until the next test pilot program starts, when that is ????

See my YouTube channel showing the last Formula Fusion build, using 'Mad Max' racing view.....well that's what R8 are calling it...it was a POV in all previous Wipeouts.

https://www.youtube.com/my_videos?o=U

[Zandit75]

I have a friend in the States who has game rendering and development experience.
I could see if he is interested for you?